1 00:00:00,450 --> 00:00:05,670 podcasting 2.0 for January 8 2021, this is Episode 19. 2 00:00:05,790 --> 00:00:13,380 We're scaling up yet again, 3 00:00:14,340 --> 00:00:15,270 another Friday. 4 00:00:16,980 --> 00:00:22,260 We have a full quorum, that's two out of three. And it's good 5 00:00:22,260 --> 00:00:26,610 to be a podcaster. Adam Curry here in Austin, Texas. And I 6 00:00:26,610 --> 00:00:30,090 present to you the man who can explain podcasting to for no 7 00:00:30,090 --> 00:00:34,470 with far less hype than myself. Jones 8 00:00:36,450 --> 00:00:40,440 I'm assuming you're referring to my recent interview in the 9 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:41,670 podcast Business Journal, 10 00:00:41,700 --> 00:00:42,570 yes, but 11 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:46,350 podcast Business Journal, spotlight, hello, spotlight. 12 00:00:46,980 --> 00:00:51,870 It was somehow I managed to get the word Pornhub. In 13 00:00:54,510 --> 00:00:55,950 fact, they really appreciated that 14 00:00:55,980 --> 00:00:59,340 this should be a boost bounty of 1000 SATs every single time 15 00:00:59,340 --> 00:01:02,730 someone uses Pornhub in an interview, that's a very good 16 00:01:02,730 --> 00:01:03,180 idea. 17 00:01:04,020 --> 00:01:06,360 In retrospect, maybe not the best example. 18 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:11,520 But what's interesting is, you know, I know the story. And I 19 00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:13,830 know you've heard me tell it a million times I saw and I was 20 00:01:13,830 --> 00:01:17,790 really enjoying really loving how, first of all, and I said 21 00:01:17,790 --> 00:01:20,640 this to you privately, man, you got a great voice when you're 22 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:23,880 just Dave Jones. Well, let me tell you how all this works, you 23 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:27,180 know. And you have these thoughtful pauses between you 24 00:01:27,180 --> 00:01:31,050 know, the question and the answer. I'm a little envious. 25 00:01:31,050 --> 00:01:35,010 It's just not me. So I can never do that. But you're very good at 26 00:01:35,010 --> 00:01:38,070 and you're enjoyable to listen to. I was like, But Dave Jones 27 00:01:38,100 --> 00:01:39,240 just read the phone book to me. 28 00:01:41,280 --> 00:01:42,780 It's my stage persona as 29 00:01:42,810 --> 00:01:44,820 well. Your stage persona kicks ass. 30 00:01:46,230 --> 00:01:46,770 was good, though. 31 00:01:46,770 --> 00:01:49,290 You did a really good job of it. I enjoy I enjoyed it. Yeah, it 32 00:01:49,290 --> 00:01:49,950 was really good. 33 00:01:50,129 --> 00:01:53,369 He has an easy interview. I think we should be called 34 00:01:53,969 --> 00:01:56,759 experts. At this point in time when we get interviewed. I mean, 35 00:01:56,759 --> 00:02:00,119 like any, anytime in the media, somebody interviewed, they just 36 00:02:00,119 --> 00:02:02,999 say, you know, like, whatever experts. 37 00:02:03,360 --> 00:02:06,300 Yeah, right. Right. Right. Sources sources familiar with 38 00:02:06,300 --> 00:02:07,020 the industry? 39 00:02:07,170 --> 00:02:07,740 Yeah. 40 00:02:08,369 --> 00:02:10,799 I'm sorry. Experts familiar with the industry. Yeah, that'll 41 00:02:10,799 --> 00:02:11,069 right. 42 00:02:11,460 --> 00:02:16,080 podcasting experts, Dave Jones and Adam Curry. j. Jones. Oh, 43 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:19,950 Paul, man, so much is going I want to get them something out 44 00:02:19,950 --> 00:02:23,460 of the way right off the bat. Because I feel a little bad 45 00:02:23,460 --> 00:02:25,560 about something. I mean, not really. But I just want to set 46 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:28,830 the record straight. Not with you. We're all good brother. No, 47 00:02:28,830 --> 00:02:36,060 Rob Greenlee of Lipson who had told me privately that Lipson 48 00:02:36,060 --> 00:02:42,960 was going to support the podcast index. namespace. And that kind 49 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:46,260 of spun out into something which I was like, Wow, what's going on 50 00:02:46,260 --> 00:02:51,390 here? Yeah. And I asked him said, Can I can I say this 51 00:02:51,390 --> 00:02:54,600 publicly? He hadn't replied to me. And then I heard him mention 52 00:02:54,600 --> 00:03:00,270 it himself on the new media show. And I mean, it he said it 53 00:03:00,270 --> 00:03:04,740 and so I brought it up when we were talking to James Cridland. 54 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:09,120 And then, but but I think the headline is kind of what, what 55 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:15,210 made this a little weird is because I don't think even in 56 00:03:15,210 --> 00:03:17,850 his private message to me, he was like, yeah, we're gonna 57 00:03:17,850 --> 00:03:21,360 support this. We got a lot going on. And that's kind of what I 58 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:24,150 hear his answer was when he was queried about this. Well, we're 59 00:03:24,150 --> 00:03:26,340 not, you know, we got a lot going on, we got a new 60 00:03:26,340 --> 00:03:29,400 interface, you know, we support the index, but it was, I think 61 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:32,130 it was pushing back on the idea that they were gonna put their 62 00:03:32,130 --> 00:03:36,510 head down and, and go work on it. And, and it kind of spun 63 00:03:36,510 --> 00:03:39,270 into it. And I just feel there's a rift here, which is 64 00:03:39,270 --> 00:03:42,060 unnecessary, because just wording and it's, in a way it's, 65 00:03:42,060 --> 00:03:46,140 you know, it was kind of a headline thing that that spun 66 00:03:46,140 --> 00:03:48,750 this a little bit out of control. So 67 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:52,320 yeah, Rob Rob didn't have the best day yesterday. I don't 68 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:52,650 think 69 00:03:52,710 --> 00:03:56,040 no. And there's one other thing, because I've been following this 70 00:03:56,040 --> 00:03:59,220 change at the Board of Governors the What's it called? The RS? 71 00:03:59,220 --> 00:04:05,310 Oh, no. The podcast Academy. Yeah. And which I've not I don't 72 00:04:05,310 --> 00:04:07,470 think I've been a member. I think maybe it was a member. I 73 00:04:07,470 --> 00:04:10,140 don't know. I don't know exactly what it does. But I've never 74 00:04:10,140 --> 00:04:13,770 know what you're a member of and what you're not. I don't I am a 75 00:04:13,770 --> 00:04:17,400 member of the Hair Club for men. if that helps. Yeah. throwback, 76 00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:23,640 throwback, everybody. At none. Earlier sighs Sperling. He 77 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:27,540 passed away this past year, I think. Yeah, what a great, great 78 00:04:27,540 --> 00:04:30,510 pitch, man, great, great company. I mean, I'm reliably 79 00:04:30,510 --> 00:04:33,570 informed you. So I'm not 80 00:04:33,570 --> 00:04:34,170 going to see 81 00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:41,940 the RSS Academy or the podcast Academy. it you know, wants to 82 00:04:41,940 --> 00:04:45,780 be some kind of governing body, which is, it's kind of weird 83 00:04:45,780 --> 00:04:48,660 when you think about it. Because, you know, no, just like 84 00:04:48,660 --> 00:04:52,950 no person is the same. No podcast is the same. We see the 85 00:04:52,950 --> 00:04:58,650 index. Yeah, it's a very diverse universe across the world. And 86 00:04:58,650 --> 00:05:01,230 the main thing is kind of these techniques issues which we just 87 00:05:01,230 --> 00:05:04,230 grabbed and ran with. And all of a sudden you see the spark and 88 00:05:04,230 --> 00:05:07,020 people like, well, if these guys just say an effort, let's do it. 89 00:05:07,170 --> 00:05:10,140 Let's all jump on board. And, you know, so now we're scaling. 90 00:05:10,140 --> 00:05:13,980 And this is, and this is very nice to see. I just wanted to 91 00:05:13,980 --> 00:05:17,760 give a word, a word of warning, because when I heard that, and 92 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:20,580 I'm not quite sure what happened over there, the Academy, and 93 00:05:20,850 --> 00:05:24,690 then it was Rob was stepping down. And somehow someone said, 94 00:05:24,690 --> 00:05:27,930 Oh, no, we're replacing him, which is like, if you're 95 00:05:27,930 --> 00:05:31,830 replacing someone, someone who's done a service, and then you 96 00:05:31,830 --> 00:05:34,800 want to, you know, you want to let some people off the hook 97 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:38,670 nicely. You know, he's stepping down, let him step down. It was 98 00:05:38,670 --> 00:05:42,300 shitty move. And I'm gonna tell you right now, what's coming 99 00:05:42,300 --> 00:05:45,510 with this board of governors because I was listening to very 100 00:05:45,510 --> 00:05:47,880 interesting podcasts. I can't remember. Damn, I wish I 101 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:53,460 remember what it was short one about about podcasting. And they 102 00:05:53,460 --> 00:05:56,760 are adding del Rey McKesson to the Board of Governors. Yes, 103 00:05:56,790 --> 00:05:59,490 I noticed that, that stood out to me to you. 104 00:05:59,790 --> 00:06:03,930 And del del Rey McKesson. I know from one of the earlier mo facts 105 00:06:03,930 --> 00:06:09,270 with Adam Curry shows, this guy is a serious activist. And but 106 00:06:09,330 --> 00:06:11,850 and you know, Black Lives Matter, okay, but he's from 107 00:06:11,850 --> 00:06:15,750 Black Lives Matter, Inc, he's from the the money side, and 108 00:06:15,750 --> 00:06:19,470 this guy is going to i, i predict, he's going to cause a 109 00:06:19,470 --> 00:06:22,080 lot of ruckus, and people are going to be so worried about 110 00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:25,050 things that really don't pertain to the issues that podcasting 111 00:06:25,050 --> 00:06:31,830 has. I prefer to make podcasting more open and more diverse for 112 00:06:31,830 --> 00:06:36,090 everybody by fixing the actual infrastructure and what needs to 113 00:06:36,390 --> 00:06:41,010 be done between development and development. And this feels to 114 00:06:41,010 --> 00:06:44,100 me like you're gonna get a top down nasty ass push, and it's 115 00:06:44,100 --> 00:06:47,280 gonna be about the unions, and it's just, it's gonna ruin and 116 00:06:47,310 --> 00:06:50,610 I'm just saying, This is my experience. I don't know Dell, 117 00:06:50,610 --> 00:06:53,460 right, McKesson, I only know what what has been discussed 118 00:06:53,460 --> 00:06:57,090 about them. And what I've read. just seems like that's going to 119 00:06:57,090 --> 00:06:59,520 be a big pain in the ass. And I think that I think it's a big 120 00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:02,550 mistake. I think whatever they're doing that this this is, 121 00:07:02,640 --> 00:07:04,140 this is not going to turn out well. 122 00:07:05,370 --> 00:07:08,400 Yeah, it's funny. I don't know much about the podcast Academy. 123 00:07:08,430 --> 00:07:14,310 But I don't think there's a lot of question marks about what 124 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:18,600 actually mean, other than the ones that do the Emmys? Like the 125 00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:19,530 award? I don't I 126 00:07:19,530 --> 00:07:23,640 really don't know. They did the, at some point, I thought the pot 127 00:07:23,670 --> 00:07:26,580 they did the there was a podcast awards that they did. And then 128 00:07:26,580 --> 00:07:29,430 it was the podcast or Hall of Fame? And I don't know, I really 129 00:07:29,430 --> 00:07:32,430 don't know, I have no idea. It's just a different approach a 130 00:07:32,430 --> 00:07:35,580 different set of philosophies there. Because we like if if 131 00:07:35,580 --> 00:07:39,150 you're trying to this is this goes back, I think to our 132 00:07:39,150 --> 00:07:42,810 problems with with all and why we've done things the way we've 133 00:07:42,810 --> 00:07:47,010 done it is the problems with standards bodies and working 134 00:07:47,010 --> 00:07:49,860 groups, and 501, c threes and all this kind of stuff. I mean, 135 00:07:49,860 --> 00:07:55,170 like, if if the answer to the problems with diversity and 136 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:57,900 equality and these kinds of things, is just putting somebody 137 00:07:58,290 --> 00:08:02,520 on the board, a different person on the board of your nonprofit. 138 00:08:03,030 --> 00:08:06,540 I mean, that's just me, doesn't change anything. It doesn't 139 00:08:06,540 --> 00:08:09,150 really change that isn't actually changed. boots on the 140 00:08:09,180 --> 00:08:10,710 like the way things are on the ground. 141 00:08:10,740 --> 00:08:13,770 It's also not it's not a problem. There's no problem with 142 00:08:13,770 --> 00:08:18,660 anybody, anybody can start a podcast, it's open to all that 143 00:08:18,660 --> 00:08:21,420 this is this is what's insane to me. Now, if you want to be on 144 00:08:21,420 --> 00:08:24,870 Spotify, or highlighted on Spotify. Yeah, I can see people 145 00:08:24,870 --> 00:08:28,920 going after that. Oh, you only highlighted three black 146 00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:32,910 podcasters Oh, the white ones. Yeah, it's like, that's the shit 147 00:08:32,910 --> 00:08:35,760 they're gonna do. It's unproductive, I think 148 00:08:35,850 --> 00:08:36,630 unproductive? 149 00:08:36,989 --> 00:08:41,759 Yeah, that's the I don't understand what the mean, I 150 00:08:41,759 --> 00:08:44,339 guess just understand what the top down approach does. And 151 00:08:44,339 --> 00:08:47,939 we'll see what it gets you other than just like some news 152 00:08:47,939 --> 00:08:50,459 releases and that kind of thing. Yeah, some piece and press and 153 00:08:50,459 --> 00:08:53,069 press and stuff. Yeah. But then at the end of the day, I mean, 154 00:08:53,069 --> 00:08:56,999 like, you really have to help people. I guess it would be more 155 00:08:56,999 --> 00:09:01,409 impressive if to me if if there's going to be like a 156 00:09:01,409 --> 00:09:04,499 political approach to this thing, which who knows what this 157 00:09:04,499 --> 00:09:06,539 will be. But I mean, if it's going to be sort of a political 158 00:09:06,539 --> 00:09:09,929 thing, it will be more impressive to me if they if he 159 00:09:09,929 --> 00:09:12,359 had somebody that said we're going to start we're going to 160 00:09:12,359 --> 00:09:16,139 start this other organizations that is going to actually help 161 00:09:16,499 --> 00:09:19,349 bring in give grants and that kind of thing, like putting 162 00:09:19,349 --> 00:09:23,489 money where your mouth is and actually help get those things 163 00:09:23,489 --> 00:09:26,879 started rather than just pressuring from it it seems like 164 00:09:26,879 --> 00:09:30,959 it's going to end up being if it plays out that way as a 165 00:09:30,959 --> 00:09:33,239 political organizing type. pressuring somebody pressure 166 00:09:33,239 --> 00:09:36,989 group ad advertising pressure curtain? Yeah. Yeah, it's 167 00:09:37,079 --> 00:09:40,289 because and that's kind of why it always is 168 00:09:40,380 --> 00:09:43,530 that will implode it will implode it man, it's just not a 169 00:09:43,530 --> 00:09:48,480 smartwatch. Anyway, I just want to say I like Rob Greenlee. This 170 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:52,080 from this point on, when Lipson starts implementing the 171 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:56,160 namespace, we'll know we've achieved success. So now we have 172 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:58,650 a marker, you know, it's like I'm okay with it. I really I 173 00:09:58,650 --> 00:10:01,830 just ate and I wanted to quit. Any like oh Lipson sucks cuz 174 00:10:02,310 --> 00:10:04,710 they got they got all kinds of stuff going on over there 175 00:10:04,710 --> 00:10:06,030 everybody has stuff going on 176 00:10:06,299 --> 00:10:10,799 so and they seem to really be they seem to really be focused 177 00:10:10,799 --> 00:10:14,009 on that new version of their their Lipson Sheriff and all 178 00:10:14,009 --> 00:10:16,769 this I think they're I think they're very busy right now 179 00:10:17,100 --> 00:10:21,510 but if we achieve enough scale where their clients or customers 180 00:10:21,510 --> 00:10:26,190 are saying hey, we want these tags to implement them that's it 181 00:10:26,190 --> 00:10:29,790 so and and I love what Cridland does Cridland was absolutely 182 00:10:29,790 --> 00:10:32,310 right to report this, you know, but he reports it like a 183 00:10:32,310 --> 00:10:37,770 reporter, which is why you listen to it nuanced in 184 00:10:37,770 --> 00:10:41,370 everything, but yeah, yeah, I agree. Rob probably didn't have 185 00:10:41,370 --> 00:10:41,850 a good day. 186 00:10:42,389 --> 00:10:47,489 Yeah, there's a lot a lot of blood Oh, wait, I said this. But 187 00:10:47,489 --> 00:10:51,089 wait, wait acid, this laser, so much backtracking yesterday, 188 00:10:52,289 --> 00:10:53,639 kinds of things. Now 189 00:10:53,639 --> 00:10:55,949 we have an exciting guest we're going to bring in in a moment. 190 00:10:56,819 --> 00:11:00,089 One of the podcasting 2.0 developers who's been using the 191 00:11:00,089 --> 00:11:03,299 podcast I think started when, when when we popped up, he 192 00:11:03,299 --> 00:11:06,839 popped up pretty quickly. And keep it keep it a secret no 193 00:11:06,839 --> 00:11:11,399 surprise for now. I just wanted to touch briefly on what we're 194 00:11:11,399 --> 00:11:15,779 doing with the lightning payments. So people kind of have 195 00:11:15,779 --> 00:11:16,919 an idea of where we're at. 196 00:11:18,090 --> 00:11:22,410 We can't we cannot talk stats. No, no, we can't talk stats, and 197 00:11:22,410 --> 00:11:26,040 the Dred Scott told me straight up the last episode, 198 00:11:26,039 --> 00:11:29,609 so it was hard. Yes, it was hard, man I but I appreciate it. 199 00:11:30,539 --> 00:11:34,439 Dred Scott, who you'll find a podcast index dot social, was 200 00:11:34,439 --> 00:11:39,869 also doing the chapter markers and images for for everything I 201 00:11:39,869 --> 00:11:43,049 produce, I think, but certainly for this podcast, we appreciate 202 00:11:43,049 --> 00:11:48,059 it. It shows the power of podcasting 2.0 we have the the 203 00:11:48,569 --> 00:11:51,839 listener is participating in the process. It's very, very 204 00:11:51,839 --> 00:11:54,659 enjoyable. And I love it, because I'm like, oh, what did 205 00:11:54,659 --> 00:11:57,449 he choose? You know, what did he find important, it's fun to see. 206 00:11:59,849 --> 00:12:03,809 So where we're at right now is we have still a incredibly 207 00:12:03,929 --> 00:12:08,579 successful proof of concept with Sphinx chat. Sphinx is having 208 00:12:08,579 --> 00:12:15,209 some, just some routing and some issues itself. I mean, this is 209 00:12:15,209 --> 00:12:18,209 all pretty new. And we all of a sudden, we we dropped in, you 210 00:12:18,209 --> 00:12:22,379 know, an additional 14 to 20,000 transactions a month that that 211 00:12:22,379 --> 00:12:25,499 everyone's dealing with, which is, you know, quite excessive 212 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:30,389 use, compared to what anyone has seen. In the lightning network. 213 00:12:30,870 --> 00:12:33,630 We really hijack their whole their whole thing for 214 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:37,079 clogged up channels, everything real money was flowing, you 215 00:12:37,079 --> 00:12:41,129 know, real money's flowing. But paulito has been fantastic. He's 216 00:12:41,129 --> 00:12:44,219 been helping everybody. And the main thing we're waiting on is 217 00:12:44,219 --> 00:12:46,859 some scale, we'd like to show more people have more people see 218 00:12:46,859 --> 00:12:49,469 it. And there's, we've been working Dave and I've been 219 00:12:49,469 --> 00:12:54,149 working on a couple other ways to to get this going with some 220 00:12:54,149 --> 00:12:56,789 other players in the market. So you know, we've there's 221 00:12:57,359 --> 00:13:02,159 graham@voltage.io very excited about working with him because 222 00:13:02,159 --> 00:13:06,029 we have a specific way of putting a new proof of concept 223 00:13:06,029 --> 00:13:07,739 into place you want to talk about that real briefly because 224 00:13:07,739 --> 00:13:11,429 I think it's this is probably the the most exciting 225 00:13:12,299 --> 00:13:16,079 progression we've had of this system with the value for value 226 00:13:16,079 --> 00:13:16,859 pledge model. 227 00:13:17,220 --> 00:13:19,830 What do you what do you want me to talk to you specifically 228 00:13:19,830 --> 00:13:20,070 like, 229 00:13:20,670 --> 00:13:23,940 Well, I'll tell you what I think we're gonna do with him and then 230 00:13:23,940 --> 00:13:26,190 maybe you can fill in the missing bits and and the 231 00:13:26,190 --> 00:13:27,240 technical information. 232 00:13:27,840 --> 00:13:31,830 Okay, yeah, cuz I think it's gonna be if I'm not mistaken, it 233 00:13:31,830 --> 00:13:37,200 may end up being similar to what? pod station and Gilman 234 00:13:38,070 --> 00:13:43,530 gear gear man. Man, I can't I struggle to say his name. With 235 00:13:43,530 --> 00:13:47,670 what? With what he's doing with you know, he when he showed his 236 00:13:47,670 --> 00:13:49,410 proof of concept, right talking? Yeah, cuz 237 00:13:49,409 --> 00:13:52,289 he he all sudden popped up. And there he is. He's like, Oh, 238 00:13:52,319 --> 00:13:54,629 look, watch this. Hold my beer boys. 239 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:56,340 Yeah. Yeah. 240 00:13:56,909 --> 00:14:01,349 So I think so he has a way of Well, anyway, I'll tell you what 241 00:14:01,349 --> 00:14:06,329 my the wireframe of the idea is you have any podcast This is 242 00:14:06,719 --> 00:14:11,009 it's all working. This is the future. Do you have any podcast 243 00:14:11,009 --> 00:14:13,949 app, and you hear your favorite podcasts that you're listening 244 00:14:13,949 --> 00:14:17,279 to host say, hey, join the pledge model. Look at your 245 00:14:17,279 --> 00:14:20,609 podcast app right now. And there's a little a little icon 246 00:14:20,639 --> 00:14:23,909 and it's for the pledge and you hit that and up pops a Hey, do 247 00:14:23,909 --> 00:14:27,059 you want to have a podcast wallet? You want $10? in here? 248 00:14:27,089 --> 00:14:30,029 Okay. Yep, put in your credit card. Alternatively, if you have 249 00:14:30,029 --> 00:14:34,109 Bitcoin, you can do it that way. And then it's authenticated, 250 00:14:34,109 --> 00:14:38,009 paid, you set your value slider, how many sets you want to send a 251 00:14:38,009 --> 00:14:39,419 minute, and you're done. 252 00:14:41,340 --> 00:14:42,180 Yeah, that's, 253 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:43,200 that's the dream. 254 00:14:43,769 --> 00:14:47,249 That's the dream and the only thing that will the only thing 255 00:14:47,249 --> 00:14:50,999 that makes that complicated and in the current iteration of it 256 00:14:50,999 --> 00:14:56,609 is that if you It involves potentially a macaroon. Right, 257 00:14:56,669 --> 00:15:00,269 right, right, right. And that we're trying desperately I'm 258 00:15:00,269 --> 00:15:03,209 trying to work to get around. And I don't know if it's 259 00:15:03,209 --> 00:15:06,569 possible or not. But if we Because see, that's the thing 260 00:15:06,569 --> 00:15:10,319 with voltage they have. Yeah, they hit you can buy your your 261 00:15:10,319 --> 00:15:15,269 node, but you're not really. You're, they've got that set up 262 00:15:15,269 --> 00:15:17,369 where it's like you, you put your credit card and you buy 263 00:15:17,369 --> 00:15:20,639 your node. That's different. That's there's no currency 264 00:15:20,639 --> 00:15:22,589 conversions or anything like that taking. 265 00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:27,930 Notice that there's no, there's no UX at all, really, for a 266 00:15:27,930 --> 00:15:30,420 simple user. And there's no channels, there's lots of stuff 267 00:15:30,420 --> 00:15:31,200 we got to work on. 268 00:15:31,860 --> 00:15:34,650 Because it's a heat because he doesn't have to do he doesn't 269 00:15:34,650 --> 00:15:37,170 have to do any of the like, know, your customer stuff, and 270 00:15:37,170 --> 00:15:40,740 all that kind of stuff. Because the KYC thing, because he's not 271 00:15:40,740 --> 00:15:45,330 actually he's getting paid to run them. Right? The virtual 272 00:15:45,330 --> 00:15:48,060 hardware he's not getting paid to buy you can exchange money. 273 00:15:48,060 --> 00:15:52,950 Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So that's, that's where it gets tricky is 274 00:15:52,950 --> 00:15:56,700 like, we got to figure out a way to be able to interact with a 275 00:15:56,700 --> 00:16:01,230 node in a way that doesn't put, you know, all that stuff into 276 00:16:01,230 --> 00:16:03,540 place, because I don't think he wants to get involved in that 277 00:16:03,540 --> 00:16:06,300 either. You know, with KYC, and all that, because that's 278 00:16:06,300 --> 00:16:09,270 a big pain in the butt. Right? Then there's this, the next 279 00:16:09,270 --> 00:16:12,690 opportunity to do that is with possibly with L SAP. But that's 280 00:16:12,690 --> 00:16:16,950 where the macaroon comes in. So anyway, we're, we're, we're 281 00:16:16,950 --> 00:16:17,370 pushing. 282 00:16:18,899 --> 00:16:20,459 And trying. Yeah. 283 00:16:20,730 --> 00:16:25,080 And while we're pushing, breeze wallet, they're still heads down 284 00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:29,100 on development, and their ideas to come out with an app that 285 00:16:29,130 --> 00:16:32,070 work the views get in the app store, and it's good to go. You 286 00:16:32,070 --> 00:16:34,320 still have to fill it up with Bitcoin. And you can do that 287 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:39,420 through an exchange in their app. So I have like, I see, I'm 288 00:16:39,420 --> 00:16:42,630 like the kid who has his nose pressed against the window 289 00:16:42,630 --> 00:16:45,360 looking and seeing the thing they really want, you know, like 290 00:16:45,420 --> 00:16:49,290 what can I just scheming and devising? Like, how can I get on 291 00:16:49,290 --> 00:16:51,390 the other side of that window? I can see. 292 00:16:54,450 --> 00:16:55,290 Right here, I 293 00:16:55,290 --> 00:16:59,070 can see it all I can see it all right. Do you have anything else 294 00:16:59,070 --> 00:17:01,890 that we need to go over everything? We need to do sexy 295 00:17:01,890 --> 00:17:03,510 namespace talk today, or? 296 00:17:03,960 --> 00:17:06,480 Yeah, we do need to be a little bit of 60 namespace talk. We can 297 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:08,190 do that with Martin, though. Oh, 298 00:17:08,250 --> 00:17:11,820 that's a good idea that you got clips too. I'm kind of saying 299 00:17:11,820 --> 00:17:14,280 this because I see something really nice here in my I haven't 300 00:17:14,280 --> 00:17:15,000 listened to it 301 00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:20,039 yet. We will be able to bring Martin in. Yeah, we'll drop our 302 00:17:20,039 --> 00:17:20,639 new jingle. 303 00:17:21,180 --> 00:17:24,330 Oh my god. Ladies and gentlemen, wake the kids alert the 304 00:17:24,330 --> 00:17:28,920 neighbors. We're dropping a new jingle. Speaking of jingles, the 305 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:32,850 man who brought us our first jingle ever. In fact, I'm going 306 00:17:32,850 --> 00:17:33,810 to play it for you right here. 307 00:17:35,070 --> 00:17:39,000 You have been listening to podcasting. 2.0 visit 308 00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:42,390 podcast.com for more information, 309 00:17:42,750 --> 00:17:47,460 which was his gift to us. Ladies and gentlemen from Denmark, we 310 00:17:47,460 --> 00:17:52,170 have the developer of pod friend. And just seems like a 311 00:17:52,170 --> 00:17:56,760 super nice guy. We introduced Martin Martin to you. 312 00:17:57,990 --> 00:18:02,820 Hi, I'm, I'm extremely happy to be here. And and first of all, I 313 00:18:02,820 --> 00:18:05,610 just want to say that I think that it's it's a bit unfair that 314 00:18:05,610 --> 00:18:09,030 they made Robert Greenleaf stepped down just because Lipson 315 00:18:09,030 --> 00:18:11,100 didn't didn't want to implement the new namespace. 316 00:18:14,010 --> 00:18:15,900 And he's funny ladies and gentlemen. 317 00:18:18,180 --> 00:18:21,120 You just try it, you're just trying to pile on James Kirtland 318 00:18:21,120 --> 00:18:23,430 is what you're doing more headlines that he has to defend 319 00:18:23,430 --> 00:18:24,660 as if he was the one that did it. 320 00:18:25,770 --> 00:18:29,520 So Martin, I have so many questions, I need to ask a 321 00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:32,430 couple of basic things. Because you live in what the United 322 00:18:32,430 --> 00:18:35,940 Nations has deemed the happiest place on earth. Everybody knows 323 00:18:35,940 --> 00:18:40,440 that Denmark is the best place to live. And what do you think 324 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:43,110 that is? Is it your life work balance generally, because of 325 00:18:43,110 --> 00:18:45,390 all the people I've ever seen in my life, I think you have the 326 00:18:45,390 --> 00:18:45,990 best. 327 00:18:47,369 --> 00:18:51,209 I think it's the work life balance. And it's probably also 328 00:18:51,209 --> 00:18:55,319 like our social security nets that, like if you lose your job, 329 00:18:55,409 --> 00:19:01,139 you don't end up on the street. And and no matter how rich or 330 00:19:01,139 --> 00:19:03,929 poor Your parents are, you can still take an education, you can 331 00:19:03,929 --> 00:19:07,019 still go to the university and college you will even get paid 332 00:19:07,019 --> 00:19:12,509 to do so I think. I think it's that. You don't have to worry as 333 00:19:12,509 --> 00:19:15,809 much. But I also think that in the media, you know, they always 334 00:19:15,809 --> 00:19:19,139 say that, hey, Denmark is the happiest nation in the world. 335 00:19:19,139 --> 00:19:23,219 And then all the Danish people would be like, what? No. Well, I 336 00:19:23,219 --> 00:19:24,029 also understand that 337 00:19:24,930 --> 00:19:27,750 what I've understand from the numbers is Denmark also has the 338 00:19:27,750 --> 00:19:30,210 most people using antidepressants, which I thought 339 00:19:30,210 --> 00:19:34,320 was kind of interesting, and it makes sense. And everyone taking 340 00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:36,390 an antidepressant you're all real happy. So 341 00:19:38,460 --> 00:19:40,470 but I don't think antidepressants make you happy, 342 00:19:40,470 --> 00:19:41,640 though, but no. 343 00:19:42,420 --> 00:19:44,220 But they make you fill out the form properly. 344 00:19:44,460 --> 00:19:46,620 So yeah. And then and then 345 00:19:46,620 --> 00:19:49,440 the news that reached the United States this week, Martin I Oh, 346 00:19:49,470 --> 00:19:53,160 my goodness. I hope you heard it. I'm so happy to be speaking 347 00:19:53,850 --> 00:19:56,250 to a representative from your country. 348 00:19:56,880 --> 00:19:58,350 explaining to do yeah, 349 00:19:58,410 --> 00:20:01,830 was so what reached our shores. with great fanfare and went 350 00:20:01,830 --> 00:20:05,460 viral is a brand new kids television show in Denmark. Oh, 351 00:20:05,460 --> 00:20:09,720 wow. Featuring a man with the longest penis in the world. And 352 00:20:09,750 --> 00:20:12,960 I'm glad we have you to put that into context for us. 353 00:20:13,020 --> 00:20:14,400 Yeah. Give us your thought. What are you learning? 354 00:20:14,640 --> 00:20:15,420 What are you learning? 355 00:20:15,570 --> 00:20:16,140 Martin? What 356 00:20:16,140 --> 00:20:18,300 are you learning about the man with the largest penis in the 357 00:20:18,300 --> 00:20:18,690 world? 358 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:23,910 And yeah, so I I've only seen trailers, because of course, 359 00:20:23,910 --> 00:20:26,610 yeah, it went viral. But yeah, it's done pillar man, which is 360 00:20:26,610 --> 00:20:29,280 like john Willie. So, 361 00:20:29,790 --> 00:20:31,170 john, really? Okay. 362 00:20:31,890 --> 00:20:39,150 Yeah. So so I think our national television station, you know, 363 00:20:39,150 --> 00:20:42,540 they're always trying to push the boundaries. And I like that. 364 00:20:43,350 --> 00:20:47,640 And, yeah, basically, I think what they're trying to say is 365 00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:51,720 that adults will see this as like sexualized, but kids in the 366 00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:54,480 target group, which is like between five and eight, they 367 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:57,810 will not they will just think it's funny. And it's probably 368 00:20:57,810 --> 00:21:01,380 right. Yeah. You see on Facebook and stuff that that is that is 369 00:21:01,380 --> 00:21:04,020 true children just like, yeah, that's really funny. 370 00:21:04,740 --> 00:21:09,030 That's very interesting. And I'm changing my thoughts on this. 371 00:21:09,510 --> 00:21:13,440 When I was growing up in the Netherlands, sexuality was a 372 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:16,650 very different thing than it is today. It was, you know, you go 373 00:21:16,650 --> 00:21:19,920 to the Sport Club, you know, like play hockey or soccer, 374 00:21:20,130 --> 00:21:24,030 football. And there would be men and women dressing rooms and 375 00:21:24,030 --> 00:21:27,630 showers. I mean, this was this was, and now we're talking 40 376 00:21:27,660 --> 00:21:32,400 years ago, longer, longer than that 45 years ago. But it was 377 00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:37,800 much more open. And I remember specifically, in fact, coming 378 00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:42,720 from the United States, how people who had disabilities were 379 00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:47,400 much more open in Europe. Whereas where we were coming 380 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:50,670 from at the time that we like, wow, this someone who's really 381 00:21:50,670 --> 00:21:52,830 messed up, you know, you didn't really see that in America, 382 00:21:52,830 --> 00:21:55,740 these people were kind of kept behind closed doors. And so 383 00:21:55,740 --> 00:21:58,620 there's been this interesting shift where the United States 384 00:21:58,620 --> 00:22:01,380 has gotten more open, I think, much more open towards 385 00:22:01,770 --> 00:22:06,240 sexuality. But at the same time, the puritanical Americanism has 386 00:22:06,270 --> 00:22:09,060 kind of spread across the rest of the world. It's really it's 387 00:22:09,060 --> 00:22:09,780 really high. 388 00:22:09,900 --> 00:22:12,420 So yeah, yeah, that's definitely true. Yeah, 389 00:22:12,450 --> 00:22:14,640 now they think about it that that long penis thing, there's 390 00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:15,390 something to it 391 00:22:16,589 --> 00:22:20,009 that late, but Oh, okay. Well, you need to drop our new jingle 392 00:22:20,009 --> 00:22:20,249 then. 393 00:22:21,089 --> 00:22:22,139 Which one is that? 394 00:22:22,410 --> 00:22:24,870 Yes. The jingle hot. namespaced. Oh, 395 00:22:25,260 --> 00:22:26,010 oh, yeah, baby. 396 00:22:26,790 --> 00:22:30,780 And now it's time for some hot namespace. 397 00:22:34,260 --> 00:22:36,300 That Jennifer, that's amazing. Yeah, yeah. 398 00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:41,400 I gotta hear that one more time. Let's just say Hey, guys, we're 399 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:43,020 here on the show. Now 400 00:22:43,019 --> 00:22:44,159 it's time for some 401 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:48,870 hot names. That's right, ladies, throw your panties on the stage. 402 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:51,300 We're gonna show you the namespace. 403 00:22:52,109 --> 00:22:54,089 She did that one for me on this on this slot? 404 00:22:54,750 --> 00:22:56,160 is phenomenal. 405 00:22:56,940 --> 00:22:57,750 national treasure? 406 00:22:58,290 --> 00:23:04,650 Yes, national treasure. So Martin. I'd love to know a 407 00:23:04,650 --> 00:23:07,050 little bit more about you. But maybe we just start with how you 408 00:23:07,050 --> 00:23:12,510 heard about podcast index. And, and how you kind of jumped in. 409 00:23:12,810 --> 00:23:15,630 And just your whole feeling about it so we can understand. 410 00:23:15,900 --> 00:23:17,910 You know, what we've seen from you. It's just nothing but a 411 00:23:18,120 --> 00:23:23,370 super nice, optimistic positive guy who implements my dreams 412 00:23:23,370 --> 00:23:27,150 within 30 seconds. So you're on my real good side. Like really 413 00:23:27,150 --> 00:23:29,730 good. Because, you know, this is like, holy shit. I'm getting 414 00:23:29,730 --> 00:23:30,840 everything I asked for. 415 00:23:33,089 --> 00:23:35,339 That's very nice works. Well, I 416 00:23:35,340 --> 00:23:38,550 mean, it I mean, the pod friend, the web app now that I'm on 417 00:23:40,380 --> 00:23:44,670 what's that? Damn oS? I'm on grafico OS. I mean, even kicks 418 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:49,350 ass. I have it as a web app. And it's it functions it does 419 00:23:49,350 --> 00:23:50,580 everything I want it to do. 420 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:55,680 Well, the feedbacks funny, that's, yeah. It's funny, as you 421 00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:58,830 know, I used to be an Android and and everything was just 422 00:23:58,830 --> 00:24:02,700 working. And it was so nice. And then I got an iPhone as my 423 00:24:02,700 --> 00:24:05,490 primary phone just you know, also so I could do development 424 00:24:05,490 --> 00:24:09,780 and it's just crap. It's only working in the browser. And and 425 00:24:09,810 --> 00:24:14,250 there's so many, you know, problems developing for the 426 00:24:14,250 --> 00:24:15,450 mobile Safari. So 427 00:24:15,510 --> 00:24:20,340 it really it really is interesting. I mean, even a day 428 00:24:20,340 --> 00:24:21,480 if you know the river 429 00:24:21,810 --> 00:24:22,260 on 430 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:26,430 freedom controller, sometimes my pins articles will get stuck. 431 00:24:27,210 --> 00:24:30,840 Okay, turns out that's, that's not the server. It was the 432 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:34,110 iPhone, the Safari browser can handle that. And I did it on 433 00:24:34,110 --> 00:24:37,710 graphene. It's like, boom, done. Three seconds. Sounds weird 434 00:24:37,710 --> 00:24:39,630 going on was what they're doing. What do you think that is? 435 00:24:39,630 --> 00:24:41,640 Martin? They just hate us. 436 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:47,790 No, I, I think it's partly because mobile Safari is just 437 00:24:48,060 --> 00:24:52,350 not very good. I mean, I'm sure they have great developers. But 438 00:24:52,410 --> 00:24:54,390 I don't know if it's not prioritized. And then I think 439 00:24:54,420 --> 00:24:59,250 definitely, progressive web apps are certainly not prioritized. I 440 00:24:59,250 --> 00:25:03,570 think it's good. You'd like as a danger to the business model of 441 00:25:03,570 --> 00:25:04,380 the App Store. 442 00:25:04,410 --> 00:25:07,080 Yeah, it is. I mean, it totally is. That's not that's not just 443 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:10,380 a, you know, that's not just fear. That's true. Because if 444 00:25:10,380 --> 00:25:15,120 progressive web apps become a strong competitor, yeah, no, you 445 00:25:15,120 --> 00:25:17,460 know, native apps. I mean, that's a that's a deal. Killer. 446 00:25:17,460 --> 00:25:17,580 They 447 00:25:17,580 --> 00:25:21,300 talk a big, big game about it, though. Yeah. And that was the 448 00:25:21,780 --> 00:25:23,580 original vision, I think. 449 00:25:23,609 --> 00:25:27,959 Yeah. But on the other hand, I don't know if you know, but on 450 00:25:27,959 --> 00:25:31,649 the Google Play Store, they actually allowing progressive 451 00:25:31,649 --> 00:25:35,069 web apps in the store. Now you can submit a progressive web 452 00:25:35,069 --> 00:25:38,729 app, and people can buy it and download it. That's, that's 453 00:25:38,729 --> 00:25:43,949 amazing. That's, that's cool. That's a dream. Yeah. Yeah. And 454 00:25:43,949 --> 00:25:46,889 the same actually, with the Microsoft Store. They also like 455 00:25:46,889 --> 00:25:50,579 as a desktop app. They also allowing it now. So I plan to 456 00:25:50,849 --> 00:25:52,289 submit part rent. 457 00:25:52,829 --> 00:25:56,669 Oh, that's cool. Well, that is progressive. It has 458 00:25:56,670 --> 00:25:59,700 the Mac App, go and go in is that I haven't had a chance to 459 00:25:59,700 --> 00:26:01,410 download it yet. I was gonna do it last. Oh, yeah. You 460 00:26:01,410 --> 00:26:09,270 got a nice plug there for. For pod. Mac. Yep. And so So yeah, I 461 00:26:09,270 --> 00:26:12,270 think it's working out great. Except I found out that auto 462 00:26:12,270 --> 00:26:15,660 update will only work if it's signed. Everyone who's 463 00:26:15,660 --> 00:26:18,450 downloaded it so far, I will have to ask them to redownload 464 00:26:18,450 --> 00:26:23,490 it. And that's, that's just that. So to get that done before 465 00:26:23,490 --> 00:26:25,110 I push it more? Okay, I've 466 00:26:25,110 --> 00:26:28,980 got a question for you on that. Because if if you? Did you 467 00:26:28,980 --> 00:26:31,320 initially push it through the website, not through the app 468 00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:31,710 store? 469 00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:35,280 Yeah, it's also the Web Store. And you even have to right click 470 00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:40,980 and press open to avoid like to have that will allow you to meet 471 00:26:40,980 --> 00:26:43,980 at all, which is how I think like to prevent it being 472 00:26:44,310 --> 00:26:47,820 malware and stuff. How can you sign it? If you're not good? 473 00:26:47,820 --> 00:26:49,860 Does that mean you're gonna have to put it in the Mac App Store, 474 00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:52,830 or you're just gonna have to put a developer certificate on it? 475 00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:58,020 I think you can do it outside the App Store if you sign it. 476 00:26:58,020 --> 00:27:03,210 But of course, I want to put it in the App Store. And I'm just 477 00:27:03,210 --> 00:27:06,180 been holding off because I definitely want to auto update 478 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:08,010 to work before I do that. 479 00:27:08,730 --> 00:27:10,770 Yeah, that because I don't I don't know how that works. I 480 00:27:10,770 --> 00:27:12,660 know. And though on the windows side, you can sign you can 481 00:27:12,660 --> 00:27:15,720 digitally sign any executable. But then on the Mac side, I 482 00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:19,500 wasn't sure how that works. Because I think in order to not 483 00:27:19,500 --> 00:27:22,560 get that prompt, I think it's not enough. And then correct me 484 00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:24,870 if I'm wrong. I don't think it's enough to just sign it. I think 485 00:27:24,870 --> 00:27:32,550 you have to sign it and be on Apple's approved. vendor. list 486 00:27:32,550 --> 00:27:36,150 that might be true. Like, I haven't looked into it. That 487 00:27:36,150 --> 00:27:38,790 much it I know you have to use Xcode, which is a pain because 488 00:27:38,790 --> 00:27:43,050 Windows is my platform of choice. So I have I have an old 489 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:47,430 MacBook Pro, which I'm using for it because the new m one. Mac 490 00:27:47,430 --> 00:27:51,900 Mini is not doing it like that some of the tools is not there 491 00:27:51,900 --> 00:27:52,410 yet, but 492 00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:55,650 I Oh yeah, I've got an M one. And I've struggled with it with 493 00:27:55,710 --> 00:27:59,370 some of the it's like everything works on most of the stuff 494 00:27:59,370 --> 00:28:02,550 works. But then when you have to go in and like I was installing 495 00:28:02,550 --> 00:28:06,540 a Ruby developer environment, and a bunch of those things 496 00:28:06,540 --> 00:28:09,540 didn't compile. So he had to jump through a bunch of hoops to 497 00:28:09,540 --> 00:28:09,900 get it. 498 00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:13,710 Yeah. Also, I just want to say that it's amazing that now this 499 00:28:13,710 --> 00:28:16,680 show, you know, covered namespaces. And now we can get 500 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:19,860 like the hot developer talk as well like to scale up the last 501 00:28:19,860 --> 00:28:20,400 few people. 502 00:28:23,460 --> 00:28:24,960 We're trying our formula. 503 00:28:25,079 --> 00:28:28,259 We're driving to zero audience on this show. We're really 504 00:28:28,259 --> 00:28:31,829 driving hard. So Martin, tell us about yourself, man, you're 505 00:28:32,129 --> 00:28:34,979 where do you live in Denmark? What do you do? I we presume you 506 00:28:34,979 --> 00:28:35,849 have a day job? 507 00:28:36,420 --> 00:28:40,950 Yeah, so so I live in Copenhagen, or just, I guess for 508 00:28:40,950 --> 00:28:43,710 most people, it will be at the Copenhagen. I live just outside 509 00:28:43,710 --> 00:28:48,480 of Copenhagen. And I work as a product manager for a company 510 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:51,390 called trustpilot, which is like they do an online review 511 00:28:51,390 --> 00:28:57,270 platform. And it's it's great, but I just missed developing. 512 00:28:57,720 --> 00:29:01,530 Before joining trustpilot I had 20 years of programming 513 00:29:01,530 --> 00:29:06,900 experience it well, if not more, but. And yeah, I've just always 514 00:29:06,900 --> 00:29:09,450 been enjoying it. And suddenly I found myself, you know, not 515 00:29:09,450 --> 00:29:13,110 coding and there's like, ah, I need something to do. And and of 516 00:29:13,110 --> 00:29:16,860 course, I have had other projects. But then I, I think 517 00:29:17,070 --> 00:29:21,660 roughly a year ago, I started developing pot friend and I used 518 00:29:21,660 --> 00:29:27,510 the apple API, you know, as people did back then. And and I 519 00:29:27,510 --> 00:29:31,110 actually looked through my old emails and I and I found that on 520 00:29:31,170 --> 00:29:34,860 August 2020. I wrote James Crippen and actually and said, 521 00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:39,750 Hey, James, you seem like the expert on podcasts? Like what 522 00:29:39,750 --> 00:29:44,100 what are options for for for podcast directories? Because, 523 00:29:45,210 --> 00:29:48,210 you know, apple, you know, their API is rate limited. So as soon 524 00:29:48,210 --> 00:29:53,220 as you have just a tiny bit of success, then listen to that 525 00:29:53,220 --> 00:29:53,700 people. I 526 00:29:53,699 --> 00:29:55,799 didn't know that. What's the what's the rate limit? I'd know 527 00:29:55,829 --> 00:29:58,679 Oh, it of course because it would be from a central source 528 00:29:58,679 --> 00:30:03,329 or not? No. All right for you pulling it in. Yeah. 529 00:30:03,869 --> 00:30:06,029 Yeah. So so 530 00:30:06,089 --> 00:30:11,129 I think can you pay a ping? Can you pay to get more a higher 531 00:30:11,129 --> 00:30:12,239 rate limit from Apple? 532 00:30:12,810 --> 00:30:16,530 No, but I actually wrote them. Because they do have an 533 00:30:16,530 --> 00:30:19,680 enterprise program where once a day, you can get like a huge 534 00:30:19,710 --> 00:30:25,380 thing. 10 gigabyte file set up in information. And, and that 535 00:30:25,380 --> 00:30:28,950 would be perfectly fine for me. But basically, they replied 536 00:30:29,610 --> 00:30:32,760 that, like, they were being kind, but basically, between the 537 00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:39,060 lines, they said, You're too small scram. And also, they said 538 00:30:39,060 --> 00:30:41,730 that, you know, if you're just making a podcasting app, then 539 00:30:41,730 --> 00:30:44,910 you're not interesting. You have to actually promote music and 540 00:30:44,910 --> 00:30:49,410 books and TV shows for partnership program. It's not 541 00:30:49,410 --> 00:30:50,460 the podcast, actually. 542 00:30:51,930 --> 00:30:52,470 I get you. 543 00:30:52,859 --> 00:30:57,629 I was a bit depressed. I can understand. Yeah. And then and 544 00:30:57,629 --> 00:31:03,479 then in pop news, in when was it? I can't remember. But it was 545 00:31:03,479 --> 00:31:08,069 in September, I think, you know, suddenly, James robear that 546 00:31:08,939 --> 00:31:14,789 Curry is talking about making, you know, podcasting. 2.0. And, 547 00:31:15,329 --> 00:31:18,209 and I look in my emails, and I wrote you right after and say, 548 00:31:18,209 --> 00:31:24,869 hey, I want to be part of this. And and then you put me in touch 549 00:31:24,869 --> 00:31:30,299 with Dave. And it was before the website was even live. And then 550 00:31:31,109 --> 00:31:35,399 it was just super easy to get started. And then yeah, yeah, 551 00:31:35,399 --> 00:31:39,239 the rest is history, as they say. Yeah. So that was amazing. 552 00:31:40,109 --> 00:31:40,889 Yeah, as seen, 553 00:31:41,100 --> 00:31:46,200 there's there's another. There's another app that I've just 554 00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:49,980 launched, called, I think it was on, I think it was in pod news. 555 00:31:49,980 --> 00:31:53,790 Today, Ted got a horrible name, tap tape, or something like 556 00:31:53,790 --> 00:31:58,560 that. And they seem to be using the lesson notes API. And, you 557 00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:01,710 know, there's, I think that's a paid thing. It's like 100, and 558 00:32:01,740 --> 00:32:04,080 something dollars a month or something like that. And that 559 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:08,820 that's another thing that we do, we try to keep this thing free 560 00:32:08,820 --> 00:32:11,940 as much as you can. Because even 100 bucks, if you're not making 561 00:32:11,940 --> 00:32:17,520 any money off your app, even 100 bucks hurts me, it hurts because 562 00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:19,590 you don't know how long it's gonna last. It's like, Well, 563 00:32:20,070 --> 00:32:23,250 okay, maybe I'll get some paid users. But if it lasts a year, 564 00:32:23,340 --> 00:32:27,450 that's like, 12 $100 out of my pocket, that I can't get back, 565 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:31,440 you know, not if you if you got Venus, not like you have most of 566 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:35,130 these people have VC backers, or anything like that. I mean, just 567 00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:38,280 be trying to launch in, you know, not lose your shirt on it 568 00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:41,610 at the same time. So, yeah, there may be other options out 569 00:32:41,610 --> 00:32:42,450 there, but they hurt 570 00:32:42,839 --> 00:32:43,649 September, 571 00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:48,870 I did actually look at the at listen notes back then. And, and 572 00:32:49,170 --> 00:32:55,290 I was thinking of starting to use less notes. But the price 573 00:32:55,290 --> 00:32:57,750 model, you know, when you're when you're making software, you 574 00:32:57,750 --> 00:33:01,560 always have this dream? Or maybe at some day, it will, like just 575 00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:06,030 take off and then just like, how much would that cost? And like, 576 00:33:06,030 --> 00:33:07,770 would they just cut taxes? And then? 577 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,570 Yeah, well, that we think about that in the in the other way 578 00:33:12,570 --> 00:33:15,990 around? Because we have people like somebody contacted me a 579 00:33:15,990 --> 00:33:20,490 couple of days ago, and asking, you know, as I'm thinking about 580 00:33:20,490 --> 00:33:25,410 bringing a potentially bigger service to use the index, will 581 00:33:25,410 --> 00:33:27,630 you'll be able to handle that load. And I said, you know, 582 00:33:27,930 --> 00:33:30,540 first of all, thank you for asking first. Yeah, because that 583 00:33:30,540 --> 00:33:34,920 makes it really nice. But then, you know, it's like, we don't 584 00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:39,540 want to necessarily grow the index super big, super fast, 585 00:33:39,540 --> 00:33:42,420 because we can't handle that either. I mean, like, you know, 586 00:33:42,420 --> 00:33:45,270 I mean, the more people that use our service, the more you're 587 00:33:45,270 --> 00:33:47,820 gonna it's gonna cost us on monthly hosting and that kind of 588 00:33:47,820 --> 00:33:48,300 thing. So 589 00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:50,790 Dave Jones bandwidth 590 00:33:51,119 --> 00:33:54,629 today? Yeah. So you mean, you got to be careful about the way 591 00:33:54,629 --> 00:33:57,749 you scale things just the Internet has, it is a two edged 592 00:33:57,749 --> 00:34:01,499 sword, it can allow you, it allows you the ability to scale 593 00:34:01,499 --> 00:34:06,059 way faster than you can then you actually should you get to kind 594 00:34:06,059 --> 00:34:07,829 of control that a little bit, you know? 595 00:34:08,310 --> 00:34:11,430 Well, we're experts at launching things slowly. Dave. 596 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:15,120 I like it terminology. 597 00:34:16,589 --> 00:34:21,209 Squish. Yeah, definitely. Also, I like a human factor for that 598 00:34:21,209 --> 00:34:25,049 as well. I mean, you might have noticed that that in the start, 599 00:34:25,049 --> 00:34:29,249 I developed like insanely fast sometimes. And, and, and I think 600 00:34:29,249 --> 00:34:34,859 my girlfriend at one point called me pot cysts. Like she 601 00:34:34,859 --> 00:34:39,239 loved that I'm really passionate about it. But I think you know, 602 00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:43,019 at one point, it was like more sprinting. For me and now I 603 00:34:43,019 --> 00:34:47,039 think, Okay, this is actually a marathon like, I need I need to, 604 00:34:47,099 --> 00:34:50,159 you know, move things slow. But also I 605 00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:53,520 really want to thank you when when I asked you to build the 606 00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:57,120 RSS builder how you jumped on that was so incredibly kind 607 00:34:57,120 --> 00:35:00,750 because you solved an enormous problem at that moment. And that 608 00:35:00,750 --> 00:35:03,840 was really above and beyond. And I just want to thank you again 609 00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:05,910 for doing that. And yeah, 610 00:35:06,030 --> 00:35:10,260 no problem. And I, it's always a pleasure to make things that, 611 00:35:10,350 --> 00:35:13,800 you know, will actually solve a problem and and is getting used, 612 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:16,710 I hope I can improve it even more, because I think right now 613 00:35:16,710 --> 00:35:21,450 it's, it ended in a bit of a black hole, but, but I hope I 614 00:35:21,450 --> 00:35:24,360 hope we can expand upon it even more in the future. 615 00:35:24,750 --> 00:35:30,180 Definitely. And so I'm actually looking at the email September 616 00:35:30,180 --> 00:35:33,600 2, when I got I got your first email, interestingly enough, 617 00:35:33,810 --> 00:35:36,600 it's very nice to reread that I completely forgotten about that. 618 00:35:36,870 --> 00:35:42,180 Now, what what I like the most about your work is you are to me 619 00:35:42,240 --> 00:35:49,590 a perfect example of, of developers really, it's an art 620 00:35:49,590 --> 00:35:54,180 and a science. And it's not just the what you're doing with the 621 00:35:54,180 --> 00:35:56,790 code under the hood, but you're also kind of a really good 622 00:35:56,790 --> 00:36:02,100 developer designer. I mean, you you design interfaces, that, I 623 00:36:02,100 --> 00:36:04,800 think Firstly, you design them real fast. Do you have 624 00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:05,940 experience with this? 625 00:36:07,140 --> 00:36:09,780 I mean, you should see, I think I actually have a screenshot on 626 00:36:09,780 --> 00:36:16,350 my, on my desktop. That shows how many iterations I go through 627 00:36:16,350 --> 00:36:21,120 sometimes. Yeah, I think I had like over 20 different 628 00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:25,890 variations of the front page of the mobile app. And I think I 629 00:36:25,890 --> 00:36:29,970 drove my girlfriend crazy one time at like sending her like, 630 00:36:29,970 --> 00:36:32,520 we don't live together, so I kept sending her on an 631 00:36:33,270 --> 00:36:37,590 unchecked. Like, what about this one? Or this one? Oh, yeah, this 632 00:36:37,590 --> 00:36:37,770 one. 633 00:36:42,090 --> 00:36:44,730 Martin's girlfriend's like, Hey, I'll get back to you. I'm 634 00:36:44,730 --> 00:36:47,370 watching that new TV show with the guy with a super long penis. 635 00:36:47,370 --> 00:36:47,640 I'll 636 00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:50,700 be right back. Gotta be 637 00:36:50,700 --> 00:36:52,980 careful, man. You can't leave your woman alone can't 638 00:36:53,670 --> 00:36:58,770 do that is true. Oh, yeah. So 639 00:37:00,570 --> 00:37:04,290 I'm trying not to be too fanboy ish, because I really enjoy so 640 00:37:04,290 --> 00:37:07,890 much what you've done. And it is my daily driver. I mean, I I 641 00:37:07,890 --> 00:37:11,910 tried to use every single app that comes out of the out of our 642 00:37:12,090 --> 00:37:15,330 development. And some Actually, I use in different use cases 643 00:37:15,330 --> 00:37:19,530 like pod station. I use in the studio all the time, because 644 00:37:19,530 --> 00:37:23,010 it's, you know, it's a browser extension, pop, boom, he got 645 00:37:23,010 --> 00:37:26,340 something right away. It's incredibly handy for me. Hyper 646 00:37:26,340 --> 00:37:31,350 catcher, of course, they use for currently for creating the 647 00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:36,990 chapters. But I also asked my wife, Tina, to, I want you to 648 00:37:36,990 --> 00:37:44,070 use because she she's a fan of Tim Poole. She likes Megyn 649 00:37:44,070 --> 00:37:48,870 Kelly, of course, no agenda show mo facts. She does not listen to 650 00:37:48,870 --> 00:37:53,520 the hot namespace talk. She has tried to appreciate it. But I 651 00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:58,200 said, Oh, well, I'd like you to try pod friend. And and you 652 00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:01,350 know, these are the things you really find out right. And now 653 00:38:01,410 --> 00:38:03,750 she will be very honest with me. And she says, Now, I want you to 654 00:38:03,750 --> 00:38:05,850 tell Martin, when you talk to I'm still using it. I really, 655 00:38:05,850 --> 00:38:08,100 really like and she had two pieces of feedback for you. 656 00:38:08,970 --> 00:38:14,850 Yeah, one. She says she would really love some kind of 657 00:38:14,910 --> 00:38:18,630 explainer video or something that just quickly shows the main 658 00:38:18,630 --> 00:38:22,290 features because she found them hard to discover, which I'm sure 659 00:38:22,290 --> 00:38:25,620 is and we talked about the mini player, which she had no idea 660 00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:28,500 and I see you've changed things and the flow feels better. I 661 00:38:28,500 --> 00:38:32,610 can't quite even put my own finger on it. So that was one 662 00:38:32,610 --> 00:38:35,670 piece of feedback. But the funniest one this morning was 663 00:38:36,060 --> 00:38:39,840 how come I can't create a chapter on it. Like, Ooh, okay. 664 00:38:42,210 --> 00:38:47,310 So so I can definitely it talks about, like the onboarding. Like 665 00:38:47,340 --> 00:38:50,070 actually learning how to use the app is something that I 666 00:38:50,070 --> 00:38:54,000 definitely want to do. Like, I actually share the podcast app 667 00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:58,650 on both my facebook profile and my LinkedIn profile. And, and I 668 00:38:58,650 --> 00:39:01,800 felt really bad doing that, because I like, oh, there's so 669 00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:05,910 many things that I've done or not done and yeah. And and I 670 00:39:05,910 --> 00:39:10,260 think giving people an introduction to how to use it. 671 00:39:11,190 --> 00:39:15,510 Like, even just something as simple as, like a, you know, 672 00:39:16,170 --> 00:39:21,510 arrow pointing, like search for a podcast here. Like, I will 673 00:39:21,510 --> 00:39:22,230 definitely do that. 674 00:39:22,290 --> 00:39:24,840 Yeah, I'm a fan of those kinds of tutorials. I like that better 675 00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:26,760 than a video myself. I like that too. 676 00:39:26,790 --> 00:39:30,600 Yeah, as long as there's a skip button for the empower. Yeah, 677 00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:34,980 exactly. Yeah. Yeah. But But, um, yeah, I think my to do list 678 00:39:34,980 --> 00:39:39,630 is like, you know, insanely long like every time I get an idea, 679 00:39:39,660 --> 00:39:46,770 write it down. And, and I tried to be selective to select, or to 680 00:39:46,770 --> 00:39:49,560 develop a little bit of quality of life that just makes the app 681 00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:52,890 better. A little bit of new things that will, you know, give 682 00:39:52,890 --> 00:39:56,610 it a bit of exposure like then you will share the link or the 683 00:39:56,610 --> 00:40:00,660 news like because something is new and interesting and And also 684 00:40:00,660 --> 00:40:03,930 thinks that we'll just move it forward, like, you know, the 685 00:40:03,930 --> 00:40:08,010 login so that that that's not interesting in itself. But as 686 00:40:08,010 --> 00:40:12,180 soon as I have the synchronization right on mobile 687 00:40:12,180 --> 00:40:15,720 and and and the best of app, then it's interesting as I tried 688 00:40:15,720 --> 00:40:18,840 to, you know, split out. And then, of course that things 689 00:40:18,840 --> 00:40:21,630 where it's a little bit hit and miss, like, I've worked a lot on 690 00:40:21,630 --> 00:40:26,220 the chat lately, and it's working nice. But then I'm 691 00:40:26,220 --> 00:40:29,160 thinking like, how many people actually use like a real time 692 00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:32,430 chat? Maybe, you know, it would be better with like, a feed 693 00:40:32,430 --> 00:40:35,970 structure. But no, it's there. And well, I haven't released it 694 00:40:35,970 --> 00:40:36,180 yet. 695 00:40:36,180 --> 00:40:38,370 But what are you using for the back end for that? 696 00:40:39,150 --> 00:40:47,250 So I programmed my own server, of course, as you do, but no, 697 00:40:47,250 --> 00:40:59,100 that was a joke. Because that would be nice. But in the end, I 698 00:40:59,550 --> 00:41:04,590 thought it was kind of easier for my own purposes to do to 699 00:41:04,620 --> 00:41:07,530 work my own, because then I know, I can save each chat 700 00:41:07,530 --> 00:41:11,760 message with a timestamp for the specific point in the episode 701 00:41:12,270 --> 00:41:12,690 like that. 702 00:41:14,070 --> 00:41:14,760 But a lot of 703 00:41:16,200 --> 00:41:19,710 Yeah, but on the other hand, then it's like, do I really want 704 00:41:19,710 --> 00:41:23,100 to do that? Do I want to save the conversations? Or do I just 705 00:41:23,100 --> 00:41:26,970 want it to be a live chat? Because I also want to make it 706 00:41:26,970 --> 00:41:30,630 into a widget so that I can tell podcast host Hey, crap, this 707 00:41:30,720 --> 00:41:33,270 chat chat widget and put it on your own website? Yeah. 708 00:41:34,170 --> 00:41:35,190 That's a good idea. 709 00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:41,850 And and, yeah, so so I haven't completely, you know, finished 710 00:41:41,850 --> 00:41:44,730 that. But I do hope that, you know, over the next couple of 711 00:41:44,730 --> 00:41:49,290 weeks, that's to finish the Chat Chat. And then there's the 712 00:41:49,290 --> 00:41:52,800 matter of two chapters, which I think is interesting, because I 713 00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:55,890 made the whole chapter builder thing, which was not really a 714 00:41:55,890 --> 00:42:00,420 success. And I, I can, it's not that nice to use, I think I can 715 00:42:00,420 --> 00:42:05,340 easily improve it, but as a road on podcast, index that socials 716 00:42:05,340 --> 00:42:09,750 that, right now, there's like this competition that that hyper 717 00:42:09,750 --> 00:42:13,770 capture is really good at, like, the chapters and the community 718 00:42:13,770 --> 00:42:16,830 chapters. And I felt like, hey, if I, if I do something like 719 00:42:16,830 --> 00:42:19,560 that, it's just like a meet who really wants to solve, like how 720 00:42:19,560 --> 00:42:24,450 we can work together as apps to share this. chapters. Like 721 00:42:24,450 --> 00:42:26,880 that's, that's, that's what I would like to solve. I 722 00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:30,480 agree. I'm glad you're thinking that way. Because that's that, 723 00:42:30,720 --> 00:42:36,720 you know, Mo Mo facts does, he gives me a lot of feedback on 724 00:42:36,720 --> 00:42:40,320 was he's a real YouTuber, and he's a little more down. He 725 00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:42,510 always said, Adam, I'll give you something from the street, man, 726 00:42:42,510 --> 00:42:46,290 you gotta listen up for podcasting. 2.0. And without a 727 00:42:46,290 --> 00:42:54,960 doubt, the the ability to chat is huge. That's what YouTube is. 728 00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:58,080 But also, there's this new app, it's iOS only, I think it's 729 00:42:58,080 --> 00:42:58,650 called. 730 00:43:00,270 --> 00:43:00,900 God, it's 731 00:43:00,900 --> 00:43:06,810 not cloud share. It's he told me about it. It's on waitlist right 732 00:43:06,810 --> 00:43:10,440 now. But that's pretty much listening to your favorite 733 00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:14,940 podcasts. And I think there's some kind of simultaneous chat, 734 00:43:14,970 --> 00:43:19,590 he says that's Bubbling Under. But really, anyone who can solve 735 00:43:19,590 --> 00:43:26,280 the cross app problem, have a chat is going to really 736 00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:31,350 invigorate the entire the entire ecosystem, that will be huge. 737 00:43:32,670 --> 00:43:36,930 And I did think about just making, you know, open 738 00:43:36,930 --> 00:43:40,110 endpoints, so that that, that if people want to, you know, 739 00:43:40,110 --> 00:43:42,690 implement the chat, then they can just do that in their own 740 00:43:42,690 --> 00:43:45,750 client and just call like, send message and get messages right, 741 00:43:46,320 --> 00:43:49,830 then I'm like, that that's not really open. That's just very 742 00:43:49,830 --> 00:43:53,310 centralized API server. And I'm not I'm not even ready to become 743 00:43:53,310 --> 00:43:54,570 that centralized point. So 744 00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:54,930 you don't 745 00:43:55,950 --> 00:44:01,050 know. I've looked at things there is, I think it's called 746 00:44:01,050 --> 00:44:05,550 matrix.org. And I haven't tried it. So it might be horrible, but 747 00:44:06,060 --> 00:44:12,180 I think they they're trying to be like a distributed chat. So I 748 00:44:12,180 --> 00:44:18,300 would love to try something like that. But like the nonprofit 749 00:44:18,300 --> 00:44:20,160 also, I think, and 750 00:44:20,910 --> 00:44:25,230 I think the lightning stuff, really the effects that comes 751 00:44:25,230 --> 00:44:27,870 into play too, because I agree. One thing you see with with 752 00:44:27,870 --> 00:44:32,550 things is that the real sort of revolutionary thing that they 753 00:44:32,550 --> 00:44:37,050 did was charging per message. And if you charge like a tiny 754 00:44:37,050 --> 00:44:40,890 little amount, you know, tiny little micro payment per 755 00:44:40,890 --> 00:44:44,640 message. It doesn't really if you don't, you don't it's small 756 00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,250 enough to where you don't think about it. You're not thinking oh 757 00:44:47,250 --> 00:44:50,040 my god, this is expensive. I'm not going to chat very much each 758 00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:53,400 t few chat freely because it's really not costing you very much 759 00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:57,150 at all. But there's also that anti spam protection. Yes, yes, 760 00:44:57,150 --> 00:45:01,230 you can't just spam and and Like, if you just mouthed off 761 00:45:01,230 --> 00:45:04,830 and put a bunch of racist comments in into something mean, 762 00:45:04,830 --> 00:45:06,600 it's going to get deleted and you're going to lose your money. 763 00:45:06,720 --> 00:45:09,900 Yeah. And what's cool about what they put it in is they have this 764 00:45:09,900 --> 00:45:13,920 concept of a stake. So if you look at it, when you, when you 765 00:45:13,920 --> 00:45:18,000 post a message, it doesn't cost you one Satoshi it can cost you 766 00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:23,190 51, Satoshi, some even more. So, you know, and so you get that 767 00:45:23,190 --> 00:45:27,390 back the the extra 50 after a set amount of time, which I 768 00:45:27,390 --> 00:45:31,170 think standard is two hours. So if within that two hours, you 769 00:45:31,170 --> 00:45:34,770 turn into incredible douchebag or you're spamming, then you can 770 00:45:34,770 --> 00:45:37,800 be blocked from the group, and then you lose all the state 771 00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:41,310 money that you put in. So and and i think it works. And it was 772 00:45:41,310 --> 00:45:44,910 interesting is even when you join one of those Sphinx tribes, 773 00:45:44,910 --> 00:45:47,760 you see, hey, it costs 10 cents to send a message. I'm like, 774 00:45:47,970 --> 00:45:51,690 wow, do I really want to send a message and 10 satoshis? You 775 00:45:51,690 --> 00:45:54,060 know, it's like, it's like nothing. It's a speck of dust. 776 00:45:54,390 --> 00:45:58,140 But still it so it really has a psychological effect. And I 777 00:45:58,140 --> 00:46:01,470 think what Dave is saying is that, yeah, we're not there yet. 778 00:46:01,710 --> 00:46:04,680 But man, we're getting damn close. Because that you know, 779 00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:09,090 what people would call web 3.0. I really am seeing this type of 780 00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:12,240 blockchain, particularly for the, you know, for a 781 00:46:12,240 --> 00:46:16,170 decentralized community type thing, even what Brian of London 782 00:46:16,170 --> 00:46:20,730 would do is doing with this hive blockchain yet, that's also 783 00:46:20,730 --> 00:46:24,420 something we should look at. I mean, that, that seems you also 784 00:46:24,420 --> 00:46:25,680 pay money for that, you know, 785 00:46:25,980 --> 00:46:29,790 I don't know how well it would be open, maybe open cross cross 786 00:46:29,790 --> 00:46:33,600 app chat runs on hive or something. Because that's the 787 00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:36,780 thing is, you know, when you're talking, Martin, I'm thinking 788 00:46:37,080 --> 00:46:40,380 immediately of all the ways that you know, this is going to 789 00:46:40,380 --> 00:46:44,370 number one is going to be abused, and it's going to hurt 790 00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:48,120 you. And then you also have this idea of like, Okay, well, then 791 00:46:48,150 --> 00:46:50,520 he has some sort of moderation because you're going to have 792 00:46:50,520 --> 00:46:53,160 some whack job come in and start spewing out, you know, the 793 00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:55,980 racism or something like that. So then, then you're, then 794 00:46:55,980 --> 00:46:59,190 you're gonna, that's going to be on your dime down to, you know, 795 00:46:59,190 --> 00:47:02,850 shoulder, but then if you put if you put if you go back to sort 796 00:47:02,850 --> 00:47:07,830 of like this decentralized, pay, like, pay per message, steak, 797 00:47:07,950 --> 00:47:13,020 steak a certain amount of money anti spam type deal, then what 798 00:47:13,020 --> 00:47:17,070 it does is it it lets the community moderate itself, and 799 00:47:17,070 --> 00:47:20,820 you don't have to have some sort of top down moderation. Where 800 00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:23,370 did you see like, on Twitter, where they're having to cut, you 801 00:47:23,370 --> 00:47:27,510 know, they're, they, it's on them to moderate their platform? 802 00:47:27,630 --> 00:47:32,520 If, if every, if the message is cost you money, and there's a 803 00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:36,810 way to stake it and revert it, then the community can police 804 00:47:36,900 --> 00:47:39,600 itself? And you know, I You don't have to do that. 805 00:47:41,940 --> 00:47:45,720 Yeah, I think, you know, every time I build a feature, I always 806 00:47:45,720 --> 00:47:48,780 think, Okay, how much headache? Is this gonna cost me in the 807 00:47:48,780 --> 00:47:54,180 future? Because I've had ideas like, for people to, like, I 808 00:47:54,180 --> 00:47:57,180 love True Crime podcast, but like, that's my dirty secret. 809 00:47:57,660 --> 00:47:58,710 Now, we 810 00:47:58,710 --> 00:48:00,570 see what you highlight on the homepage. 811 00:48:02,340 --> 00:48:07,020 We see Yeah, exactly. So um, and in those, you know, I always, 812 00:48:07,650 --> 00:48:10,890 like, that's actually one of the reasons also why I started pot 813 00:48:10,890 --> 00:48:16,020 friend, I was like, I wanted to have like, it well, preferably 814 00:48:16,020 --> 00:48:19,200 interactive content, but also just content, like the chapters, 815 00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:22,770 and things like that. And going even further than that. So you 816 00:48:22,770 --> 00:48:25,920 could see, like, let's say, a timeline, and you could scroll 817 00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:30,180 in it, and, and you could see a map and all these things that, I 818 00:48:30,180 --> 00:48:33,090 think that I want to look at, at some point, and hopefully, you 819 00:48:33,090 --> 00:48:38,430 know, in an open fashion, but yeah, 820 00:48:38,459 --> 00:48:42,059 that's, that's the secret to the best software. The best software 821 00:48:42,059 --> 00:48:46,139 is the is the software that the developer uses himself, or he 822 00:48:46,139 --> 00:48:49,919 has created for his or herself and uses on a daily basis. 823 00:48:49,919 --> 00:48:54,359 Because they, when they're using their own app, and it's, you 824 00:48:54,359 --> 00:48:56,609 know, it's gonna be good because they're gonna have the same 825 00:48:56,609 --> 00:48:57,719 issues that you have. 826 00:48:58,140 --> 00:49:01,170 Exactly. And I do use parchment everyday like both on the 827 00:49:01,170 --> 00:49:04,800 desktop, which was also one of the driving factors, because I 828 00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:09,150 work and when I program, I love listening to podcasts sometimes. 829 00:49:09,150 --> 00:49:12,660 And I was really lacking a good desktop app as well. And so that 830 00:49:12,660 --> 00:49:16,230 was also one of the motivations and then now I've been working 831 00:49:16,230 --> 00:49:22,050 from home since last March. So I try to always, like take a daily 832 00:49:22,050 --> 00:49:27,060 walk for close to an hour and and I listen to podcasts as 833 00:49:27,060 --> 00:49:29,940 well. So that's under mobile then so it's good to get that 834 00:49:29,940 --> 00:49:33,270 mixed. Use of your own product. Yeah. 835 00:49:36,750 --> 00:49:37,950 Yes. Good. 836 00:49:38,910 --> 00:49:44,310 Yeah. Okay. So going back to like the rich content that I was 837 00:49:44,310 --> 00:49:48,090 considering, like, okay, so so users need to be able to upload 838 00:49:48,120 --> 00:49:52,110 photos as well and stuff and I was just thinking, that probably 839 00:49:52,110 --> 00:49:54,780 means that I would have to look through every single image 840 00:49:55,530 --> 00:49:56,070 uploaded 841 00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:03,240 And I thought, just as I think I've mentioned this to you 842 00:50:03,240 --> 00:50:06,690 before, but well two things one, thank you both for fixing the 843 00:50:06,690 --> 00:50:09,660 your latest episodes bug because I was trying to I was I was 844 00:50:09,660 --> 00:50:12,990 noticing a tune like, why don't I see pod news here and I'm 845 00:50:12,990 --> 00:50:15,450 seeing other things. I didn't know what I was missing really. 846 00:50:15,450 --> 00:50:17,430 And I was like, something's wrong. So you guys figured that 847 00:50:17,430 --> 00:50:18,840 and this morning I was delighted like, 848 00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:20,940 wow, okay, yeah, that was grateful. 849 00:50:22,260 --> 00:50:26,910 And thank you for the for the interface to my car. 850 00:50:28,530 --> 00:50:29,130 That's awesome. 851 00:50:29,190 --> 00:50:32,580 Oh, nice. It's beyond It's so nice. You know, I don't have to 852 00:50:32,580 --> 00:50:36,060 connect anything. And I just hit the the media button which knows 853 00:50:36,060 --> 00:50:39,300 is looking for a Bluetooth that connects it picks up where I was 854 00:50:39,300 --> 00:50:43,710 where I was playing when I had it. On my on my earphones. The 855 00:50:43,710 --> 00:50:46,980 only thing that would be super superduper is if album art and 856 00:50:46,980 --> 00:50:49,470 chapter art came through and displayed, but that may be more 857 00:50:49,470 --> 00:50:50,190 challenging. 858 00:50:50,970 --> 00:50:54,690 Yeah, so I've really tried to solve that. And it's just not 859 00:50:54,690 --> 00:50:59,400 possible. And it's not because of like the pot friend app. It 860 00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:04,080 is because no Universalist extending it. Yeah. Yeah. And 861 00:51:04,560 --> 00:51:09,450 maybe, I would guess if it's a native app, then then it would 862 00:51:09,450 --> 00:51:14,820 show up, maybe. So I have hopes that as soon as, as you know, I 863 00:51:14,820 --> 00:51:17,820 bundle it together as a native app, then maybe it will come 864 00:51:17,820 --> 00:51:20,160 through. So let's cross our fingers. 865 00:51:20,190 --> 00:51:25,500 Yeah, no, I'm just saying it's more about how phenomenal would 866 00:51:25,500 --> 00:51:29,760 be to be in the car listening, and then see the image change. I 867 00:51:29,760 --> 00:51:34,170 mean, that's how sad My life is. But really, I would be so happy 868 00:51:34,170 --> 00:51:35,880 like, James. Yeah, 869 00:51:36,090 --> 00:51:36,870 yeah. 870 00:51:37,380 --> 00:51:40,530 So are you gonna, are you gonna go to a native app? At some 871 00:51:40,530 --> 00:51:40,740 point? 872 00:51:41,580 --> 00:51:45,030 Yeah. So it's actually interesting, because pop friend, 873 00:51:45,750 --> 00:51:50,370 at one point did have a native app for iOS and Android. Like I 874 00:51:50,370 --> 00:51:53,850 just never released it. And I made like, you might know that 875 00:51:53,850 --> 00:51:58,800 the web app and the desktop apps are in react, and then their 876 00:51:58,800 --> 00:52:02,670 mobile apps I made in React Native. And that allowed me to 877 00:52:02,670 --> 00:52:07,530 reuse, like a lot of the code, but not all, like all the UI, 878 00:52:07,530 --> 00:52:14,670 you have to code from scratch. And, and, and it's just, you 879 00:52:14,670 --> 00:52:17,310 know, maintaining these two versions, then I just decided, 880 00:52:17,310 --> 00:52:20,640 you know, what, I really want to make really sure that the core 881 00:52:20,640 --> 00:52:24,300 of the app is good. Before I commit to whenever I make a 882 00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:27,570 feature that I bet that I make it in two versions instead of 883 00:52:27,570 --> 00:52:30,930 one version. So I decided to hold a little bit back on the 884 00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:37,350 native app. But yeah, I've found other tech things like just to 885 00:52:37,350 --> 00:52:41,550 go completely geeky Apache Cordova that allows you to pack 886 00:52:41,610 --> 00:52:45,750 a normal web app into a mobile app. And I'm hoping that maybe I 887 00:52:45,750 --> 00:52:49,440 can use that to just have one version. Because that would be 888 00:52:50,010 --> 00:52:52,950 extremely awesome. Because Yeah, when you're just one developer 889 00:52:52,950 --> 00:52:56,250 on your to do list is already like 10 miles long. And yeah, 890 00:52:56,280 --> 00:52:59,610 you're just always looking for, like, how can I work smarter 891 00:52:59,610 --> 00:53:00,510 instead of harder? 892 00:53:01,500 --> 00:53:05,880 Yeah, because that's gonna be a lot of work to get into UI is 893 00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:09,570 what takes 90% of the effort in any in any software, at least 894 00:53:09,570 --> 00:53:14,850 you can have. It's like it's doing is doing 5% of the work, 895 00:53:14,850 --> 00:53:16,650 but it takes 95% of the effort. 896 00:53:17,280 --> 00:53:20,280 Yeah, definitely. I cannot, I can already feel it now. Like, 897 00:53:20,340 --> 00:53:24,600 I'm finally starting to get like some solid UI components, like, 898 00:53:24,990 --> 00:53:27,750 like a pop friend component library done. So when I make 899 00:53:27,750 --> 00:53:31,140 things, I can reuse them, but but when I have to do new stuff, 900 00:53:31,440 --> 00:53:34,320 for example, like if I had to do this onboarding, showing like, 901 00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:38,010 this is how we get started. But it just takes time. Yeah, 902 00:53:38,670 --> 00:53:42,390 that's for sure. We need a new jingle. And now sexy component 903 00:53:42,390 --> 00:53:43,080 library 904 00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:48,690 named Jennifer 905 00:53:49,770 --> 00:53:50,310 Martin. 906 00:53:50,370 --> 00:53:54,060 Now, you know, part of our, our mission or part two of our 907 00:53:54,060 --> 00:53:59,220 mission is to retool podcasting as a platform of value for all 908 00:53:59,220 --> 00:54:04,620 parties. What are your thoughts on that? in general? I know 909 00:54:04,620 --> 00:54:06,660 you're familiar with the lightning stuff. I know, it's, 910 00:54:07,290 --> 00:54:10,680 it's not you know, you can't you can only focus on so much. What 911 00:54:10,680 --> 00:54:11,730 are your thoughts in general? 912 00:54:12,930 --> 00:54:16,080 So actually, let me just cover the first part of your mission 913 00:54:16,080 --> 00:54:21,210 statement. The open platform for free speech is free speech. 914 00:54:21,210 --> 00:54:25,830 Yeah. But I just think that it's so important. Like, I've had 915 00:54:25,890 --> 00:54:29,250 conversations with some of my friends and colleagues that know 916 00:54:29,250 --> 00:54:32,220 that I'm doing pot brand and they're like, well, free speech. 917 00:54:32,220 --> 00:54:35,160 Like, it's not that important. But when you look around the 918 00:54:35,160 --> 00:54:39,900 world, it's just you know, you look at China with their you 919 00:54:39,900 --> 00:54:42,360 know, social platform where you get points for being it being a 920 00:54:42,360 --> 00:54:45,900 good citizen, and you can lose the your travel privileges, if 921 00:54:45,900 --> 00:54:51,360 you're not, and you look at Russia, and like, you know, the 922 00:54:51,990 --> 00:54:54,330 opponent of the states like you know, they they will get 923 00:54:54,330 --> 00:54:56,520 poisoned and stuff and the media, you know, they're not 924 00:54:56,520 --> 00:54:59,850 really reporting on it and Well, yeah, that at least afraid of 925 00:54:59,850 --> 00:55:04,200 it. It's just, it's so so important. Like, even in, in, in 926 00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:06,960 Denmark, where we are, you know, we feel like, Oh, we have a free 927 00:55:06,960 --> 00:55:10,380 press and everything is like, Yeah, but we also have to fight 928 00:55:10,380 --> 00:55:12,960 for it. So well, thank thank you. 929 00:55:13,020 --> 00:55:15,720 I appreciate that man, I think you're doing you're a big part 930 00:55:15,720 --> 00:55:19,170 of that of that mission. And the reason why we've been talking 931 00:55:19,170 --> 00:55:21,690 about mission number two is because I feel we have already 932 00:55:21,690 --> 00:55:25,680 achieved the foundation. And yeah, with developers like you, 933 00:55:25,680 --> 00:55:28,560 and and all the plethora of developers we have and the 934 00:55:28,560 --> 00:55:31,320 holsters and everything we're doing. Yeah. I mean, we are 935 00:55:31,320 --> 00:55:34,890 absolutely doing it. It's happened. It's really, we should 936 00:55:34,890 --> 00:55:36,090 all be very proud of that. 937 00:55:36,690 --> 00:55:42,450 Yeah. And then the value part. I mean, I definitely plan to 938 00:55:42,450 --> 00:55:47,940 monetize print at some point, if I can. And I haven't really 939 00:55:47,940 --> 00:55:52,440 figured out why. No, not why not how, and I would love to do the 940 00:55:52,470 --> 00:55:58,680 lightning node. It's simply just outside of my area. Cheese. And, 941 00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:04,620 and I would just be very careful throwing my resources. Well, 942 00:56:05,100 --> 00:56:13,860 resource. Sure. Yeah, at it before I feel that that part 943 00:56:13,860 --> 00:56:17,160 friend in itself is like good enough that it can actually 944 00:56:17,250 --> 00:56:21,390 drive to get users like, I'm actually surprised every time I 945 00:56:21,390 --> 00:56:24,300 get an email and someone is using it and asking, Hey, you 946 00:56:24,300 --> 00:56:29,340 know, can I get a sleep timer? Or I'm like, oh, people are 947 00:56:29,430 --> 00:56:30,060 using it. 948 00:56:32,250 --> 00:56:36,150 That's interesting. Just, just last night, I was hoping for a 949 00:56:36,150 --> 00:56:38,850 sleep time because I wanted to listen to this one podcast, I 950 00:56:38,850 --> 00:56:42,810 knew I would fall asleep. And I know that the default is to go 951 00:56:42,810 --> 00:56:46,770 to the next next episode. Like I wish I could remember to ask 952 00:56:46,770 --> 00:56:47,490 Martin about asleep. 953 00:56:48,990 --> 00:56:52,800 Well, now you did and is already there. Oh, no, the three dots. 954 00:56:52,830 --> 00:56:55,980 And then there is a set sleep timer. It's a Yeah, it's a it's 955 00:56:55,980 --> 00:57:00,060 hidden behind the three dots. I guess. That could be? How long? 956 00:57:00,750 --> 00:57:05,370 Did I did that? I thought it was a month or so I think someone 957 00:57:05,370 --> 00:57:08,430 else was asking for it. But yeah, that that's the 958 00:57:09,720 --> 00:57:13,410 sleep timer dog. Oh my god, oh my god. 959 00:57:14,010 --> 00:57:17,460 But But actually, that highlights the, you know, ever 960 00:57:17,460 --> 00:57:20,340 existing problems of user interface. It's like, okay, you 961 00:57:20,340 --> 00:57:23,580 know, yeah, I want to hide some things that I use that much. But 962 00:57:23,580 --> 00:57:25,140 then how do people find them? And 963 00:57:25,170 --> 00:57:28,290 yeah, that's crazy, because I was looking for it. And I 964 00:57:28,290 --> 00:57:32,310 thought I tapped on the three dots. Hmm. There you go. 965 00:57:32,490 --> 00:57:36,030 Do you think you'll support? Would you support video at any 966 00:57:36,030 --> 00:57:36,360 point? 967 00:57:37,380 --> 00:57:43,080 It does support video, actually. Yeah. geek news central podcast, 968 00:57:43,080 --> 00:57:46,350 and then we'd like they have a video version, then you can 969 00:57:46,350 --> 00:57:48,360 actually see that video. 970 00:57:48,510 --> 00:57:52,830 You know, I, I've always been baffled by this now, because 971 00:57:52,830 --> 00:57:59,430 people and I'm glad you brought that up, and that many people 972 00:57:59,430 --> 00:58:03,390 have approached me on email, etc. Social media say, you gotta 973 00:58:03,390 --> 00:58:07,260 do this for video. And, you know, so fuck YouTube. And, and 974 00:58:07,260 --> 00:58:12,810 I say two things. One, one, as far as I know, every podcast app 975 00:58:12,810 --> 00:58:16,200 can can play video, as long as it's, you know, within a certain 976 00:58:16,200 --> 00:58:23,820 format realm. And, secondarily, it's never going to be like 977 00:58:23,820 --> 00:58:27,990 YouTube, because inherently it's not an algorithm. And that's 978 00:58:27,990 --> 00:58:32,220 what makes YouTube YouTube. And what, what it we're kind of in 979 00:58:32,220 --> 00:58:35,640 this interesting place where I see this entire infrastructure, 980 00:58:35,910 --> 00:58:39,690 and I can see the same infrastructure being used for 981 00:58:39,690 --> 00:58:42,510 music, I can see the same infrastructure being used for 982 00:58:42,510 --> 00:58:47,370 video. And I just, it's whatever a developer decides to surface 983 00:58:47,370 --> 00:58:50,670 and how to, you know, to focus their energy. And I was going to 984 00:58:50,670 --> 00:58:56,430 wonder if you were, maybe you need to do like one of your home 985 00:58:56,430 --> 00:58:59,250 banners, your latest episode, your latest podcast, maybe 986 00:58:59,250 --> 00:59:02,700 latest video podcast to show people that it exists, and that 987 00:59:02,700 --> 00:59:06,240 it works. It works fine. I agree. It works super well. 988 00:59:06,930 --> 00:59:09,960 Yeah, I think that's actually a great idea. I think I actually 989 00:59:09,960 --> 00:59:13,470 already asked Dave, if he could make an endpoint for me with 990 00:59:13,470 --> 00:59:17,250 latest videos, or maybe I thought about it, but yeah, oh, 991 00:59:17,250 --> 00:59:17,880 if he did, I 992 00:59:17,940 --> 00:59:18,450 don't 993 00:59:19,710 --> 00:59:22,680 know. Maybe I just thought about it. But I think what's 994 00:59:22,680 --> 00:59:28,860 interesting, like in the in the video podcasts is that it just 995 00:59:28,860 --> 00:59:33,930 works smoothly, but but actually answering Dave like, our Yeah, 996 00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:38,460 like it produced iOS. I think it was Adam. Maybe that, like old 997 00:59:38,460 --> 00:59:41,100 podcast app could play videos. No, that's actually not true. 998 00:59:41,100 --> 00:59:44,250 Like, it's, it's not. It's not that many apps actually that 999 00:59:44,250 --> 00:59:47,820 have implemented it. And I think it's just because maybe people 1000 00:59:47,820 --> 00:59:51,330 don't think about that, like podcasts as video but 1001 00:59:52,290 --> 00:59:55,290 yeah, I think that some of them can play. They'll play the 1002 00:59:55,290 --> 00:59:57,720 video, but it'll, they won't show that they'll just play the 1003 00:59:57,720 --> 01:00:00,660 audio. They play the video file, but You can't see. 1004 01:00:00,810 --> 01:00:04,020 Yeah. And I just popped up. It just popped up the new media 1005 01:00:04,020 --> 01:00:10,110 show in video. proxy works perfectly. I mean, yeah, Martin, 1006 01:00:10,110 --> 01:00:15,480 I mean, yeah, I would love to let us get that if we get that 1007 01:00:15,480 --> 01:00:17,730 endpoint going, that'd be great. Because I'd love to just see 1008 01:00:17,730 --> 01:00:21,330 what was rotating. And what's Yeah, you know, what, what, 1009 01:00:21,360 --> 01:00:25,410 what's unique about the web app? And I think, you know, when I 1010 01:00:25,410 --> 01:00:27,780 hear people use this lots of conversation, well, when I'm an 1011 01:00:27,780 --> 01:00:31,110 airplane, this won't happen, statistics won't happen. 1012 01:00:31,260 --> 01:00:33,840 Payments won't happen, all that stuff. And I'm saying to myself 1013 01:00:33,840 --> 01:00:37,800 self, the world is I mean, you get on an airplane, who's not 1014 01:00:37,800 --> 01:00:40,260 connected on the airplane anymore, everybody's connected 1015 01:00:40,260 --> 01:00:42,660 on the airplane, and it's only going to get better, there's 1016 01:00:42,660 --> 01:00:46,230 only going to be more bandwidth, more conductivity, etc. 5g, 1017 01:00:46,230 --> 01:00:50,550 besides trying, our brains will have conductivity everywhere. 1018 01:00:50,820 --> 01:00:57,030 And the problem with podcast apps and why they not, I think 1019 01:00:57,030 --> 01:01:01,080 probably been wary of supporting video is device storage, because 1020 01:01:01,080 --> 01:01:05,460 the default is to download down subscription, and then have it 1021 01:01:05,460 --> 01:01:08,220 for which was the which was necessary. This was the whole 1022 01:01:08,490 --> 01:01:12,810 the whole way podcasting came into life. And the enclosure 1023 01:01:12,810 --> 01:01:15,750 element was to download something to present a better 1024 01:01:15,750 --> 01:01:21,000 experience for the user. So you have a Oh, there's a new show, 1025 01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:24,150 click play, it works immediately. That's no longer 1026 01:01:24,150 --> 01:01:26,940 necessary. This is streaming, I'm not storing anything on my 1027 01:01:26,940 --> 01:01:29,460 device. When I'm watching the new media show. It's streaming. 1028 01:01:29,700 --> 01:01:33,000 And and that'll stream just fine to me. So I think this is 1029 01:01:33,030 --> 01:01:37,170 there's a revolution waiting to happen here. For a video. 1030 01:01:38,190 --> 01:01:42,660 I think I had, you know, to two thoughts and what you said there 1031 01:01:42,690 --> 01:01:46,800 one, like the, you know, whole web app that you know, blah, 1032 01:01:46,800 --> 01:01:50,910 blah, blah. And I think a pop friend of the web app itself is 1033 01:01:50,910 --> 01:01:53,640 not the selling point. But I think it's amazing that there 1034 01:01:53,640 --> 01:01:57,090 isn't weapon but but I'm thinking, hey, the web app is 1035 01:01:57,090 --> 01:02:01,830 there. So you can you know, just try it out. And because people I 1036 01:02:01,830 --> 01:02:04,650 think people are very careful, just, you know, getting new apps 1037 01:02:04,650 --> 01:02:09,660 and stuff I even saw like on the phone, the phones, the average 1038 01:02:09,870 --> 01:02:13,980 install rate per month is zero apps. Like that's how few brand 1039 01:02:13,980 --> 01:02:16,710 new apps people actually install. Right? So here, you can 1040 01:02:16,710 --> 01:02:20,130 try it out. And then once you're like, Hey, you know, pop friend, 1041 01:02:20,160 --> 01:02:23,550 it works great, then, you know, I'll start putting up a banner 1042 01:02:23,550 --> 01:02:26,130 like saying, hey, looks like you're using iPhone, you should 1043 01:02:26,400 --> 01:02:30,180 know get the app, right? Or looks like you're using Windows 1044 01:02:30,180 --> 01:02:35,460 and then and then you can you know, easily transition over to 1045 01:02:35,700 --> 01:02:37,140 the native experience. 1046 01:02:37,170 --> 01:02:41,760 Can I make you a marketing suggestion? Yeah, I wouldn't I 1047 01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:45,090 would remap the player to pod friend calm and then put your 1048 01:02:45,090 --> 01:02:49,380 messaging in there. This is where the iPod friend calm? 1049 01:02:49,980 --> 01:02:54,570 Yeah, I will definitely do that. And it is. I do plan to do that. 1050 01:02:55,050 --> 01:02:59,250 Because suddenly, I actually had a talk with with one of my 1051 01:02:59,580 --> 01:03:04,050 friends about it. Like, what do I actually need pot friend.com 1052 01:03:04,050 --> 01:03:09,150 for like this almost business like websites like LinkedIn. 1053 01:03:09,270 --> 01:03:13,290 Just just show them what it can do. And yeah, so exactly would 1054 01:03:13,290 --> 01:03:16,260 be a bit like if sweet, sweet. I had like a front page that's 1055 01:03:16,260 --> 01:03:19,350 like explained fully on like, oh, how social media works. 1056 01:03:22,350 --> 01:03:25,230 podcasting is a new feature in the media landscape. 1057 01:03:25,680 --> 01:03:29,250 Yeah. Well, and then regards to actually downloading video 1058 01:03:29,250 --> 01:03:33,570 podcasts, of course, I guess some some properties, 4k now and 1059 01:03:33,570 --> 01:03:37,170 stuff. But actually, mobile phones do have a lot of space 1060 01:03:37,170 --> 01:03:37,500 now. I'll 1061 01:03:37,500 --> 01:03:38,850 surely do sure they do. 1062 01:03:38,880 --> 01:03:42,390 Yeah. I don't see that as a I mean, I'm waiting for some 1063 01:03:42,390 --> 01:03:47,550 I'm waiting for someone to show up. Who says you know, I see all 1064 01:03:47,550 --> 01:03:51,390 these video podcasts. Here's a, you know, here's an apparent 1065 01:03:51,390 --> 01:03:55,110 endpoint that gives me video podcast. Why don't I just create 1066 01:03:55,260 --> 01:03:59,790 a front end? That is that looks like YouTube. And then maybe 1067 01:03:59,790 --> 01:04:02,370 I'll throw an algo in the back. And you don't have to call it 1068 01:04:02,370 --> 01:04:05,010 podcasting. That's fine with me too. 1069 01:04:05,430 --> 01:04:06,030 I don't care. 1070 01:04:06,420 --> 01:04:09,750 That that's the thing we thought about. Do you remember Adam when 1071 01:04:09,750 --> 01:04:15,360 we were first putting the skeleton up the the podcast of 1072 01:04:15,390 --> 01:04:19,200 the podcast index homepage, and we had the we had the carousel 1073 01:04:19,230 --> 01:04:23,670 that was you know, kind of lame. But the firt I was noticing that 1074 01:04:23,670 --> 01:04:28,470 the first thing that hits you is that sometimes video podcasts 1075 01:04:28,650 --> 01:04:32,790 pop up on your thing. It's like Well, okay, you have most recent 1076 01:04:32,790 --> 01:04:35,940 here. You could easily change that. Algo up a little bit. 1077 01:04:35,970 --> 01:04:38,850 Yeah. And then you have you basically just reinvented tik 1078 01:04:38,850 --> 01:04:43,020 tok, but in an open distributed RSS way. Yep. And everybody's 1079 01:04:43,020 --> 01:04:44,640 posting videos and it's just, 1080 01:04:45,270 --> 01:04:48,270 it's just a different wrapper. I mean, this this is the thing 1081 01:04:48,270 --> 01:04:52,680 that always gets me is like, especially when we get payments 1082 01:04:52,680 --> 01:04:55,860 working man. You can do it for all kinds of stuff. But it's 1083 01:04:56,100 --> 01:05:00,570 everyone and this is a testament to you, Martin. Most People are 1084 01:05:00,570 --> 01:05:04,950 stuck in the Gmail inbox model when it comes to podcast apps. 1085 01:05:05,280 --> 01:05:10,950 That's just how it always has worked. And that's a shame. 1086 01:05:10,950 --> 01:05:14,010 Because once you smoke some weed and get out of the box thinking 1087 01:05:14,010 --> 01:05:19,380 like, oh, man, we could do all this other stuff. And just 1088 01:05:19,380 --> 01:05:25,440 create a YouTube looking thing. And have this it's the same 1089 01:05:25,440 --> 01:05:28,380 mechanisms everywhere. The only difference is it only does 1090 01:05:28,380 --> 01:05:33,180 video. And it has an algorithm that presents things to you that 1091 01:05:33,180 --> 01:05:35,460 you may or may not like. Hmm, 1092 01:05:35,490 --> 01:05:38,910 that's really good. Definitely. I could definitely see, you 1093 01:05:38,910 --> 01:05:42,300 know, pot friend having like a chocolate top where you switch 1094 01:05:42,300 --> 01:05:45,090 between audio and video or something. And then whatever 1095 01:05:45,090 --> 01:05:47,370 you're in the mood for, like, Ah, you know, different 1096 01:05:47,850 --> 01:05:48,840 experience. Yeah, 1097 01:05:48,990 --> 01:05:52,590 yeah, exactly. And maybe, and maybe even like, I also thought 1098 01:05:52,590 --> 01:05:55,770 about because there are API endpoints out there like for 1099 01:05:55,770 --> 01:05:59,370 audiobooks and stuff? And I thought, That's quite close, 1100 01:05:59,370 --> 01:06:02,370 like maybe maybe introducing that as well. Like, just, 1101 01:06:02,850 --> 01:06:05,730 yes, yeah. I think we're gonna change our names to this. This 1102 01:06:05,730 --> 01:06:08,910 is not going to be the podcasting 2.0 2.0 show anymore. 1103 01:06:08,910 --> 01:06:17,040 This is going to be audio books. 2.0. Again, if audible can claim 1104 01:06:17,040 --> 01:06:21,330 that they're their podcasts, and I can claim that podcasts or 1105 01:06:21,330 --> 01:06:26,550 audiobooks if we're just making up words. Yeah. Audio. Great is 1106 01:06:26,550 --> 01:06:28,770 a great untapped territory for podcasting, I think. 1107 01:06:29,790 --> 01:06:32,250 Yeah, I think so. Because you know what, I think a lot of 1108 01:06:32,250 --> 01:06:35,640 people when they like listening to podcasts, that's probably the 1109 01:06:35,640 --> 01:06:39,870 same time where they could be listening to an audiobook. Like 1110 01:06:39,870 --> 01:06:42,960 when they're out walking or on their commute to work or 1111 01:06:42,960 --> 01:06:48,570 something. So and for me, like sometimes I like listening to 1112 01:06:48,930 --> 01:06:54,720 true crime. Sometimes I like listening to, you know, show 1113 01:06:54,720 --> 01:06:57,630 about podcasting sometimes, like just listening to the news, but 1114 01:06:57,660 --> 01:07:00,180 but I could definitely see myself listening to an audio 1115 01:07:00,180 --> 01:07:04,500 book at some point. So I think they're a good fit. And it's 1116 01:07:04,500 --> 01:07:08,760 also one way, you know, that could be a monetization because 1117 01:07:08,760 --> 01:07:12,060 most audiobooks cost money. So it could be like taking a cut 1118 01:07:12,060 --> 01:07:16,260 there or something. But yeah, currently under brainstorm 1119 01:07:16,470 --> 01:07:18,090 level, but yeah. 1120 01:07:20,190 --> 01:07:22,800 Do we want to pause and do a donation, I was just going 1121 01:07:22,800 --> 01:07:26,310 to say, let's, let's remind everybody that the entire 1122 01:07:26,310 --> 01:07:30,720 podcast index.org project, including this podcast is under 1123 01:07:30,720 --> 01:07:34,620 the value for value model. It's real simple. If there's anything 1124 01:07:34,650 --> 01:07:38,520 that we're doing here that gives you value that adds value to 1125 01:07:38,520 --> 01:07:41,070 your life, where there's just enjoyment of listening to this, 1126 01:07:41,070 --> 01:07:44,430 you might be just a podcast listener who wants to see 1127 01:07:44,490 --> 01:07:47,550 podcasting preserved as a platform for free speech, it's 1128 01:07:47,550 --> 01:07:50,850 all kinds of reasons. Just turn that into a number and send it 1129 01:07:50,850 --> 01:07:54,270 to us. That's it. And value can only be determined by you, if 1130 01:07:54,270 --> 01:07:57,810 it's whatever the value is, we'd love to see that and, and we'd 1131 01:07:57,810 --> 01:08:00,750 love to we'd love receiving that in exchange and we love doing 1132 01:08:00,750 --> 01:08:05,520 what we do. And that includes thanking the people who have 1133 01:08:05,520 --> 01:08:08,940 supported the project this week Dave's got his crumble paper 1134 01:08:08,940 --> 01:08:09,390 list 1135 01:08:09,840 --> 01:08:15,000 that David is right here. We the this makes me happy the very 1136 01:08:15,000 --> 01:08:22,710 first donation $50 from add Ryan. Ryan is is who interviewed 1137 01:08:22,710 --> 01:08:24,120 me for the podcast Business Journal. 1138 01:08:24,930 --> 01:08:26,130 Oh, man, that's 1139 01:08:26,160 --> 01:08:29,100 cool. That's, well, a thank you. 1140 01:08:29,700 --> 01:08:30,300 B. 1141 01:08:30,870 --> 01:08:35,460 I've never succeeded in doing that after an interview. So hey, 1142 01:08:35,460 --> 01:08:38,970 man, here's some money for your for your project. Nice. Well 1143 01:08:38,970 --> 01:08:40,710 done, Dave. more interviews for Dave. 1144 01:08:40,770 --> 01:08:45,630 Thank you. He's had a message said Dave and Adam. Thanks for 1145 01:08:45,630 --> 01:08:48,930 everything you guys do for the industry at Ryan radio, Inc. and 1146 01:08:48,930 --> 01:08:55,110 podcast Business Journal. Nice. Thanks for propagating. We'll 1147 01:08:55,110 --> 01:09:03,120 see. We get here's Okay. Here's another donation for $25. from 1148 01:09:03,360 --> 01:09:09,660 Daniel, Nevada. No, Daniel, Nevada, Nevada. And Daniel says 1149 01:09:09,660 --> 01:09:12,360 the podcast index project is becoming more important every 1150 01:09:12,360 --> 01:09:16,230 day. Adam for once, I think you've got your product timing 1151 01:09:16,230 --> 01:09:21,060 right on yours too soon. Please keep up the work and preserving 1152 01:09:21,060 --> 01:09:21,720 free speech. 1153 01:09:22,019 --> 01:09:25,829 I don't know man. We're on the cutting edge of the keys and 1154 01:09:25,829 --> 01:09:29,459 lightning payments. Not 10 years too early for that one. 1155 01:09:29,610 --> 01:09:33,180 Yeah, I'm gonna editorialize and say that's to be determined. 1156 01:09:33,180 --> 01:09:33,690 Right. 1157 01:09:34,260 --> 01:09:37,950 Yeah, we're, we try to do better try to be better. 1158 01:09:39,960 --> 01:09:45,690 Raphael Negron sent us $10 and he has no notes. Thank you. 1159 01:09:45,780 --> 01:09:46,410 Thank you. 1160 01:09:49,979 --> 01:09:56,459 See, is there a note on this one? Okay, yes. Stephen. Sent 1161 01:09:56,459 --> 01:10:02,399 Tony. He gave us $5 and said kicking in when I can I'm just a 1162 01:10:02,399 --> 01:10:03,149 podcast listener. 1163 01:10:03,299 --> 01:10:05,759 Oh, great. Thanks, Steve. Appreciate that. Well, we're 1164 01:10:05,760 --> 01:10:06,840 just a podcast API. 1165 01:10:07,259 --> 01:10:08,219 That's all we are, man. 1166 01:10:09,510 --> 01:10:11,280 That's, that's it. That's our guest for this week. 1167 01:10:11,850 --> 01:10:16,800 Well, shortlist shortlist, but the value was coming in and love 1168 01:10:16,800 --> 01:10:19,650 it. And thank you so much. If you want to contribute to the 1169 01:10:19,650 --> 01:10:23,910 entire proposition, go to podcast index.org. Scroll down 1170 01:10:23,910 --> 01:10:26,250 to the bottom, there's a big red Donate button, you can also 1171 01:10:26,250 --> 01:10:29,340 donate to a lightning payment. And thank you, thank you all 1172 01:10:29,340 --> 01:10:33,180 very much. And everybody who was on the recurring subscriptions, 1173 01:10:33,180 --> 01:10:37,950 which we see you. It keeps everything running and and it 1174 01:10:37,950 --> 01:10:40,200 keeps, keeps the dream alive. 1175 01:10:40,320 --> 01:10:43,500 Considering that, considering that Dred Scott said that last 1176 01:10:43,500 --> 01:10:47,130 week's show sucked, then I think that was pretty good to get for 1177 01:10:47,130 --> 01:10:47,760 donations. 1178 01:10:50,580 --> 01:10:52,680 We are ahead of the curve. We are ahead of the curve. 1179 01:10:52,710 --> 01:10:56,640 ej dropped a DC the you've been defragmented the clip in there. 1180 01:10:56,640 --> 01:10:57,600 He does that too. 1181 01:10:58,020 --> 01:11:00,570 If someone gives a donation for the first time, is that what 1182 01:11:00,570 --> 01:11:09,660 they get? Yes. That's almost a ringtone. 1183 01:11:13,980 --> 01:11:14,610 Oompa Loompa. 1184 01:11:21,780 --> 01:11:23,850 Love that. That's great. Yeah. 1185 01:11:24,900 --> 01:11:29,310 But I mean, considering that this week's episode has has 1186 01:11:29,310 --> 01:11:30,840 Martin on it. No, no. 1187 01:11:31,710 --> 01:11:34,470 Through the obvious, obvious through the roof. 1188 01:11:34,740 --> 01:11:35,310 Martin, what 1189 01:11:35,310 --> 01:11:39,510 what can we do you have any? Anything we can do for you 1190 01:11:39,510 --> 01:11:43,200 specifically? Is there Do you have any vision that you'd like 1191 01:11:43,200 --> 01:11:47,250 to see us? would look at work on? I'm sure you have dreams? 1192 01:11:47,730 --> 01:11:48,030 Yeah. What 1193 01:11:48,030 --> 01:11:49,140 do you want in the namespace? 1194 01:11:51,060 --> 01:11:51,990 Oh, hold on. 1195 01:11:53,970 --> 01:11:57,420 Oh, it's time for some namespace. 1196 01:11:58,650 --> 01:11:59,190 Bringing that. 1197 01:12:02,580 --> 01:12:08,250 I think every time I am, I want something I write Dave. Hey, 1198 01:12:08,250 --> 01:12:10,500 could this be you know, possible? And then he wrote, 1199 01:12:10,800 --> 01:12:13,860 writes back? Oh, yeah. Hey, you know, give me five minutes. And 1200 01:12:13,860 --> 01:12:14,820 then you know, it comes 1201 01:12:14,820 --> 01:12:18,270 back with a name. Unless it's a recent videos endpoint and that 1202 01:12:18,630 --> 01:12:20,520 doesn't ever get done. Yeah. 1203 01:12:20,640 --> 01:12:26,130 So my latest idea when I was working on the community 1204 01:12:26,130 --> 01:12:29,220 chapters for Pol Pot friends, because I have started working 1205 01:12:29,220 --> 01:12:33,690 on it was that, hey, it could be amazing if you could, like use 1206 01:12:33,690 --> 01:12:39,150 other texts as a chapter. So you could like give a location as a 1207 01:12:39,180 --> 01:12:43,530 as a chapter or you could give a person as a chapter. Oh, that's 1208 01:12:43,530 --> 01:12:47,310 just one thing. I was thinking. But yeah, yeah. Because then the 1209 01:12:47,310 --> 01:12:49,410 chapter chapter could be at Google map where you could 1210 01:12:49,410 --> 01:12:52,500 scroll and zoom. That would actually be pretty, pretty 1211 01:12:52,500 --> 01:12:55,080 nifty. But and Whoa, 1212 01:12:55,169 --> 01:12:58,379 oh, I'm wrapping my brain around that one. So you put elements of 1213 01:12:58,379 --> 01:13:01,739 other namespace elements referred into a separate node 1214 01:13:01,829 --> 01:13:03,359 into a different element. 1215 01:13:04,110 --> 01:13:07,560 I don't know exactly how it would work since since this 1216 01:13:07,560 --> 01:13:10,800 is namespace inception, and it's gonna break it's, everything's 1217 01:13:10,800 --> 01:13:15,510 gonna be destroyed if you can't rip the space time continuum. 1218 01:13:18,210 --> 01:13:23,010 Okay, no, but But no, I think, I think, you know, I tried to keep 1219 01:13:23,010 --> 01:13:26,160 up with the GitHub with the namespace talk, sometimes I get 1220 01:13:26,160 --> 01:13:29,760 a little bit caught up in development, and then I take a 1221 01:13:29,760 --> 01:13:32,370 break from it. But you know, there's so many things that are 1222 01:13:32,400 --> 01:13:36,600 interesting and, and, and happening. And if something goes 1223 01:13:36,600 --> 01:13:39,240 against something, you know, where I have a strong opinion, 1224 01:13:39,600 --> 01:13:42,960 like, you know, how it should work, for example, the person 1225 01:13:42,960 --> 01:13:45,630 tech, I did have some strong opinions on that, then then I 1226 01:13:45,690 --> 01:13:48,870 bought in and otherwise, I'm just, Oh, this looks like it's 1227 01:13:48,870 --> 01:13:51,060 on the right track. You know what, I'm not gonna I'm not 1228 01:13:51,060 --> 01:13:52,920 gonna bother. You know, 1229 01:13:52,950 --> 01:13:55,800 are you happy with the way it turned out? With the podcast 1230 01:13:55,800 --> 01:13:56,340 person tag? 1231 01:13:57,000 --> 01:14:01,560 Yeah. So I'm happy. The only thing that I'm sad about and you 1232 01:14:01,560 --> 01:14:05,010 know, we had a talk about that early on, is that I would still 1233 01:14:05,010 --> 01:14:08,790 love to be able to click, for example, Adam Curry and then 1234 01:14:08,790 --> 01:14:14,280 see, all the podcasts has been in all the episodes. So I still 1235 01:14:14,280 --> 01:14:19,620 think we need that. Somehow a unique ID that but I don't know 1236 01:14:19,620 --> 01:14:24,090 how to do it without a centralized thing, but that 1237 01:14:24,390 --> 01:14:27,030 would still be amazing. Do you want to 1238 01:14:27,690 --> 01:14:29,160 so you want to give me a number? 1239 01:14:30,780 --> 01:14:36,420 Yeah, so basically, somehow of identifying, it could be a 1240 01:14:36,420 --> 01:14:37,740 barcode on your forehead. 1241 01:14:51,180 --> 01:14:52,170 Say QR code. 1242 01:14:53,159 --> 01:14:55,679 QR code right there, baby. Beautiful scanning. 1243 01:14:57,780 --> 01:15:01,230 Oh, yes. No, but but it works. Wouldn't be nice like, because I 1244 01:15:01,230 --> 01:15:04,440 could definitely see the user experience like that. I'm 1245 01:15:04,440 --> 01:15:07,650 clicking Hey, this guy, Martin Martin, who has been on the 1246 01:15:07,680 --> 01:15:11,370 podcasting. 2.0. Which other podcasts has hasn't been in? Of 1247 01:15:11,370 --> 01:15:16,200 course, not. The first time I've ever seen a podcast, but you 1248 01:15:16,200 --> 01:15:19,110 know, in the future, it could be cool. Yeah, 1249 01:15:19,110 --> 01:15:22,440 I mean, in the future. I mean, everybody already does have a 1250 01:15:22,440 --> 01:15:25,830 number. Of course, we have credit card numbers, social 1251 01:15:25,830 --> 01:15:29,640 security numbers, phone numbers, we all kinds of numbers. I hope 1252 01:15:29,640 --> 01:15:32,400 that in the future, every citizen who was born or enters 1253 01:15:32,400 --> 01:15:36,420 the United States and becomes a citizen receives a Bitcoin ID. 1254 01:15:36,660 --> 01:15:40,200 Now, here's your node ID, and welcome to the country citizen. 1255 01:15:40,230 --> 01:15:42,900 And then yeah, and that's your ID. And you can use it for 1256 01:15:42,900 --> 01:15:45,720 payments for authentication for all kinds of stuff. 1257 01:15:46,590 --> 01:15:51,810 That's actually, you know, interesting, because, like, for 1258 01:15:51,840 --> 01:15:54,240 dictatorships and stuff, they could actually really use that 1259 01:15:54,240 --> 01:15:58,230 like, okay, so you spent how much money on propaganda this 1260 01:15:58,230 --> 01:16:01,650 week? Well, you know, what, Martin, and this is not exactly 1261 01:16:01,650 --> 01:16:04,980 the right form for it. But yeah, I see that coming. And it's 1262 01:16:04,980 --> 01:16:08,940 going to be the central bank, digital coins, and they're going 1263 01:16:08,940 --> 01:16:12,360 to have complete control over your money. They already have a 1264 01:16:12,360 --> 01:16:15,660 lot of control over it now. But it's going to be very easy. It's 1265 01:16:15,660 --> 01:16:18,120 going to be like, Oh, the government just gave me Venmo I 1266 01:16:18,120 --> 01:16:21,660 love it. And you're going to feel real good about it until 1267 01:16:21,660 --> 01:16:25,500 they start to do things that you won't feel good about. And 1268 01:16:26,130 --> 01:16:29,940 Bitcoin, you know, doesn't have that restriction. has all the 1269 01:16:29,940 --> 01:16:30,480 benefits. 1270 01:16:31,980 --> 01:16:34,680 Interesting. It's actually interesting. Some Danish banks 1271 01:16:34,680 --> 01:16:38,550 actually reject your payment if you're if you're trying to buy 1272 01:16:38,550 --> 01:16:43,620 bitcoin. Yeah. Wow. So and that's a lot of people that are 1273 01:16:43,650 --> 01:16:47,430 you know, unhappy about that. Like, it hasn't hasn't declined 1274 01:16:47,430 --> 01:16:49,470 any payment yet. So Wow, that's 1275 01:16:49,470 --> 01:16:51,510 proof that some of the Danish are unhappy. 1276 01:16:54,120 --> 01:16:55,110 Mythbusters 1277 01:16:55,260 --> 01:16:56,220 it's a lie. 1278 01:16:56,880 --> 01:17:00,300 I think a lot of Danish people are very great at like 1279 01:17:00,300 --> 01:17:03,330 complaining. Maybe that makes people happy. Tom. 1280 01:17:05,790 --> 01:17:10,140 Yeah, that's funny. But we that's Yeah, so we're getting 1281 01:17:10,140 --> 01:17:15,060 off topic here. But the I have a buddy who is a does mission 1282 01:17:15,060 --> 01:17:21,360 work. And he went over the summer he went to Japan. And he 1283 01:17:21,360 --> 01:17:26,430 said, Padre, even get in? I don't don't remember. You know, 1284 01:17:26,430 --> 01:17:28,620 we with this? No, I'm sorry. This wasn't over the summer. 1285 01:17:28,620 --> 01:17:30,900 This wasn't this was at the towards the end of last year. 1286 01:17:31,950 --> 01:17:36,270 Okay, it was Jan, January, December. Okay. Okay, so he said 1287 01:17:36,270 --> 01:17:43,350 that the the suicide problem in Japan is so bad that they have 1288 01:17:43,380 --> 01:17:47,550 like, little signs that light up or something like this. But 1289 01:17:47,550 --> 01:17:50,040 you'll have to correct me on this base, that there's some way 1290 01:17:50,040 --> 01:17:54,210 of signaling to the passengers on a train their trains that 1291 01:17:54,210 --> 01:17:57,270 they've had, when the train stops, they had stopped because 1292 01:17:57,270 --> 01:18:01,650 of a suicide. Oh, wow. People jumping in front of the train in 1293 01:18:01,650 --> 01:18:06,630 the Netherlands. This happens quite regularly in the code, 1294 01:18:06,630 --> 01:18:09,270 which is well known amongst citizens now. Because when they 1295 01:18:09,270 --> 01:18:13,050 say we have a delay, the trains going to stop because we have 1296 01:18:13,050 --> 01:18:16,980 some problems with the overhead wiring. That in fact is code 1297 01:18:16,980 --> 01:18:18,540 that someone jumped on the tracks. 1298 01:18:19,110 --> 01:18:22,320 Okay. Yeah. So some, something similar to that in Japan. And 1299 01:18:22,320 --> 01:18:25,620 I'm wondering if you know, if it's because there's, there's 1300 01:18:25,620 --> 01:18:28,230 validity to what you're saying, Martin, I mean, like, if you if 1301 01:18:28,230 --> 01:18:32,700 you're free to just express your anger and in, you know, complain 1302 01:18:32,700 --> 01:18:34,800 about something freely, then you get it all out? And then you're 1303 01:18:34,800 --> 01:18:37,320 fine, you're happy, you know, but if you press it, like an 1304 01:18:37,320 --> 01:18:41,400 honor, culture type thing, it just festers and how was that? 1305 01:18:41,430 --> 01:18:41,940 How was that? 1306 01:18:41,940 --> 01:18:44,580 If you don't mind me asking, since we're way off topic, how 1307 01:18:44,580 --> 01:18:48,030 was that politically in Denmark, of which I know nothing about 1308 01:18:48,030 --> 01:18:50,940 the different parties and the different movements? But are you 1309 01:18:50,940 --> 01:18:53,280 feel just everyone's like here? I would say in the United 1310 01:18:53,280 --> 01:18:57,570 States. There's, that's a good point. Dave, that's the biggest 1311 01:18:57,570 --> 01:19:00,780 problem is that there's a large group of people who are 1312 01:19:01,530 --> 01:19:04,140 apprehensive or maybe even afraid to express their 1313 01:19:04,140 --> 01:19:08,160 opinions. Not even politically, but social justice warrior Lee. 1314 01:19:09,810 --> 01:19:12,690 And, and I think that's the worst thing is the worst thing 1315 01:19:12,690 --> 01:19:15,540 that can happen is when people aren't afraid or afraid to tell, 1316 01:19:15,660 --> 01:19:18,810 to speak their mind. How is that in Denmark? Is everyone free? 1317 01:19:18,810 --> 01:19:20,880 And they feel free to do that, or is it similar? 1318 01:19:21,810 --> 01:19:27,420 I think people are actually quite free to express. Yeah, and 1319 01:19:27,450 --> 01:19:31,890 and we have a much more nuanced political system that the US 1320 01:19:31,890 --> 01:19:35,520 like, we don't have a two party system we have. I don't know 10 1321 01:19:35,520 --> 01:19:36,120 or something. Yeah, you 1322 01:19:36,120 --> 01:19:38,340 get you get a parliament parliamentary system. Right. 1323 01:19:38,400 --> 01:19:39,840 Yeah, exactly. 1324 01:19:39,870 --> 01:19:43,650 Where that helps. where no one's happy in the end. 1325 01:19:44,610 --> 01:19:45,210 Yeah. 1326 01:19:46,770 --> 01:19:50,280 It's funny because, you know, some of the small parties, you 1327 01:19:50,280 --> 01:19:54,300 know, suddenly in one election, they will get like, you know, 1328 01:19:54,750 --> 01:19:58,950 10% of the votes just because they have like some things like 1329 01:19:59,130 --> 01:20:03,210 where they like I mean, I know a lot of parties competed, like 1330 01:20:03,240 --> 01:20:06,330 being more and more racist, because that was like the site 1331 01:20:06,330 --> 01:20:14,340 guys at some point. The cool thing. And then of course, like 1332 01:20:14,370 --> 01:20:18,840 all the mainstream parties, they didn't do it but you know, there 1333 01:20:18,840 --> 01:20:22,080 always be something popping up. But But I do in general think 1334 01:20:22,080 --> 01:20:27,150 that that people are I wouldn't say completely free but but a 1335 01:20:27,150 --> 01:20:29,130 lot more free to like express 1336 01:20:30,090 --> 01:20:32,940 their points of view. Yeah, that's my that's my that's my 1337 01:20:32,940 --> 01:20:35,790 feelings on it has been for a long time I don't I'm just full 1338 01:20:35,790 --> 01:20:39,330 disclosure, I don't vote I haven't voted in 20 years on any 1339 01:20:39,330 --> 01:20:42,360 election, I just, I've completely opted out of all 1340 01:20:42,360 --> 01:20:46,230 them. I'm an imago was Emma Goldman fan, if voting change 1341 01:20:46,230 --> 01:20:49,200 anything, they wouldn't let you do that be illegal? Yeah. And so 1342 01:20:49,350 --> 01:20:52,830 that, you know, that that's the whole thing with me is my thing 1343 01:20:52,830 --> 01:20:57,300 is people are the most equal when they're the most free. And 1344 01:20:57,330 --> 01:21:01,710 when you if you take, if you restrict freedom, even a slight 1345 01:21:01,710 --> 01:21:04,140 amount of freedom of speech for you know, freedom of the press, 1346 01:21:04,170 --> 01:21:08,400 even as small quantities, immediately, equality, equality 1347 01:21:08,400 --> 01:21:12,150 goes way down. Because we that's, I think, I believe that 1348 01:21:12,150 --> 01:21:15,990 to every part of my being in that I think that's probably the 1349 01:21:15,990 --> 01:21:20,700 fight that we that all people will be fighting into, as things 1350 01:21:20,700 --> 01:21:24,030 go forward, sort of from here on out is that trying to preserve 1351 01:21:24,030 --> 01:21:26,100 equality through some measure of freedom? 1352 01:21:27,270 --> 01:21:30,510 Well, what I see, go ahead, go ahead, Martin. 1353 01:21:31,110 --> 01:21:35,820 No, it's just a funny thing. But more tragic, but I remember, 1354 01:21:36,120 --> 01:21:38,910 it's probably like four or five years ago, when there was the 1355 01:21:38,910 --> 01:21:45,090 whole, you know, that Apple was, like the people in China that 1356 01:21:45,090 --> 01:21:47,460 was assembling the phones, they were committing suicide on the 1357 01:21:47,460 --> 01:21:51,990 factory. And the way they solved it was not by improving 1358 01:21:51,990 --> 01:21:58,140 conditions and put, put nets around. And then all the 1359 01:21:58,140 --> 01:22:00,960 employees had to sign a contract that said they wouldn't commit 1360 01:22:00,960 --> 01:22:03,030 suicide while on the job. And there's 1361 01:22:05,130 --> 01:22:07,710 so many forms to fill out, please don't kill yourself on 1362 01:22:07,710 --> 01:22:12,270 our premises. Yeah, well, what I what I what I see. And what I 1363 01:22:12,270 --> 01:22:16,170 love so much is i and i look at podcasts index dot social, which 1364 01:22:16,170 --> 01:22:21,270 is really the, the, the petri dish of the whole project. And I 1365 01:22:21,270 --> 01:22:24,240 see all these people from different countries, different, 1366 01:22:24,960 --> 01:22:28,290 different backgrounds, and it's just beautiful to see everyone's 1367 01:22:28,290 --> 01:22:30,600 like, kind of working on the same thing. Do we butt heads? 1368 01:22:30,600 --> 01:22:34,590 Yeah, sure, once in a while. That's cool. But it's it's a 1369 01:22:34,590 --> 01:22:37,680 very, very, very productive civil 1370 01:22:38,880 --> 01:22:42,540 group. Yeah, I also love that there are so many different 1371 01:22:42,540 --> 01:22:46,410 people like James Kirtland, who represent us, like the new side, 1372 01:22:46,410 --> 01:22:50,220 and we have a, you know, a few people that are just, I just 1373 01:22:50,220 --> 01:22:53,880 listened. And you know, my opinion, and then we have a lot 1374 01:22:53,880 --> 01:22:57,270 of developers and I love, you know, reading what other 1375 01:22:57,270 --> 01:23:01,350 developers are doing. And you can, you know, like, me and 1376 01:23:01,350 --> 01:23:05,670 Dave, we were sitting there giving advice to to David J. 1377 01:23:05,670 --> 01:23:10,020 Lewis, yesterday about DNS, and it's just a great community. And 1378 01:23:10,020 --> 01:23:12,990 I really hope it's growing. So yeah. If anyone is listening and 1379 01:23:12,990 --> 01:23:16,470 you're interested in podcasting, or developing, you should really 1380 01:23:16,470 --> 01:23:20,790 join it's it's free to join. Yeah. 1381 01:23:21,810 --> 01:23:24,780 Yeah. Speaking of speaking of speaking of Daniel, Jason Lewis, 1382 01:23:24,810 --> 01:23:27,900 his, that that's his new middle name, JSON, 1383 01:23:28,230 --> 01:23:30,900 JSON. json Lewis. Yeah. 1384 01:23:31,410 --> 01:23:36,270 Yeah, he gave me He gave me early access to his new API's, 1385 01:23:36,270 --> 01:23:41,310 the biggest a podcast industry insights API s statistics API. 1386 01:23:41,730 --> 01:23:45,720 And so he gave me some early access to check it out and do 1387 01:23:45,720 --> 01:23:48,930 some testing on it and that kind of thing. And how is it? It's 1388 01:23:48,930 --> 01:23:51,090 great. Yeah, it's really good. It's gonna be really good. I 1389 01:23:51,090 --> 01:23:54,120 wanted to give him some kudos on that, because he's been working 1390 01:23:54,120 --> 01:23:55,830 hard at it for a couple of months for 1391 01:23:55,830 --> 01:23:57,630 a while. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 1392 01:23:57,660 --> 01:24:00,960 Yeah. So net nets. gonna be a really good product. I can. I 1393 01:24:00,960 --> 01:24:01,950 can vouch for it. 1394 01:24:02,249 --> 01:24:06,659 Yeah. But really, and just to reiterate, we want to add, like 1395 01:24:06,659 --> 01:24:08,789 we've had a lot of the hosting companies who want to talk to 1396 01:24:08,789 --> 01:24:14,579 all the developers. And Dave Jones is in charge of bookings. 1397 01:24:14,879 --> 01:24:20,039 So he's podcast index.org and you want to hit him up and now 1398 01:24:20,039 --> 01:24:23,819 but I want to meet David from hyper catcher, I want to I want 1399 01:24:23,819 --> 01:24:26,579 to meet the the pod station guy wanted to talk to everybody. I 1400 01:24:26,579 --> 01:24:29,639 mean, let's get let's get it all. Let's get as much out there 1401 01:24:29,639 --> 01:24:33,359 as possible. Your hopes, your dreams, etc. which leaves you 1402 01:24:33,359 --> 01:24:35,099 with the last word, Martin? 1403 01:24:36,480 --> 01:24:39,510 Yeah, like being a guest only cost me 20% of my future 1404 01:24:39,510 --> 01:24:46,710 earnings. So no, brilliant. No, I would, I would just say thank 1405 01:24:46,710 --> 01:24:50,940 you very much for having me. It was amazing to talk to you guys. 1406 01:24:52,050 --> 01:24:55,710 Yeah, and keep on doing the good work. I'm just so happy to be 1407 01:24:55,710 --> 01:24:57,570 part of this. This community. 1408 01:24:58,440 --> 01:25:02,130 Well, we can't thank you enough. And, and I personally can't 1409 01:25:02,130 --> 01:25:05,730 thank you enough because I really enjoy your product. It 1410 01:25:05,730 --> 01:25:09,150 just fits perfectly in my life right now. So that's Martin 1411 01:25:09,150 --> 01:25:13,080 Morton. Now you can find him. Well, most importantly, I would 1412 01:25:13,080 --> 01:25:17,460 say pod friend.com any other places at Martin that podcast? 1413 01:25:18,390 --> 01:25:21,720 podcast index out social, any other places to promote for you 1414 01:25:22,830 --> 01:25:28,290 know I think pot friend.com and and podcast, index or social. 1415 01:25:28,470 --> 01:25:30,570 Those are the places to find me. Okay 1416 01:25:30,570 --> 01:25:33,720 fantastic Martin, thank you so much. Really appreciate it. 1417 01:25:33,930 --> 01:25:35,070 Thanks, Martin. Yeah, thank you, 1418 01:25:35,100 --> 01:25:38,430 Dave. Anything for the for the last few minutes? 1419 01:25:38,550 --> 01:25:42,570 Yeah, no, I don't think so. We get I got a stack of stuff here. 1420 01:25:42,570 --> 01:25:46,200 But we at least we know the next week. Yeah, we'll do that next 1421 01:25:46,200 --> 01:25:46,380 week. 1422 01:25:47,010 --> 01:25:49,740 Another board meeting next week. Again, thanks to our guests 1423 01:25:49,740 --> 01:25:53,520 Martin Morton, and my co founder and partner Dave Jones. Thank 1424 01:25:53,520 --> 01:25:55,950 you. Thank you. It was it was a good day is a good way to wrap 1425 01:25:55,950 --> 01:25:57,780 up the week. Did the Danes are 1426 01:25:57,780 --> 01:25:59,040 happy I feel happy right now. I 1427 01:25:59,040 --> 01:26:00,990 know it's rubbing off. It's fantastic. 1428 01:26:03,540 --> 01:26:06,720 Take some of that dangerous love and go enjoy your weekend. We'll 1429 01:26:06,720 --> 01:26:09,840 talk to you next week here on podcasting. 2.0 1430 01:26:25,320 --> 01:26:29,880 You have been listening to podcasting 2.0 visit podcast. 1431 01:26:31,020 --> 01:26:32,640 For more information.