1 00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:05,430 podcasting 2.0 for November 27 2020, Episode Number 13 and 2 00:00:05,430 --> 00:00:07,380 we've got Fire in the hole. 3 00:00:11,309 --> 00:00:12,179 What does that mean? 4 00:00:12,540 --> 00:00:13,470 I don't know. 5 00:00:15,029 --> 00:00:18,449 The whole the whole is a fire. You know, it's like, I figured 6 00:00:18,449 --> 00:00:22,139 somehow I'd want to tease that we have a fiery guest or 7 00:00:22,139 --> 00:00:27,059 something like that. I don't know. Usually I come up with the 8 00:00:27,509 --> 00:00:31,619 the episode titles after the show. I'd like to stretch my 9 00:00:31,619 --> 00:00:34,769 brain a little bit. try and do them beforehand. And now ladies 10 00:00:34,769 --> 00:00:38,159 and gentlemen, the man who beat the road Oh, riding the 11 00:00:38,159 --> 00:00:38,639 lightning. 12 00:00:42,270 --> 00:00:42,900 Nice. 13 00:00:44,190 --> 00:00:47,220 This is this is unlucky. This is unlucky episode. 14 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:48,210 Why? Why is it 15 00:00:48,660 --> 00:00:49,230 13? 16 00:00:49,290 --> 00:00:54,360 Oh, no, no, it's gonna be super lucky for us. My machine's gonna 17 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:56,580 keep working. It's not going to crap out. 18 00:00:57,000 --> 00:00:57,480 Mm hmm. 19 00:00:57,510 --> 00:01:00,990 Which was yesterday morning, I had to do the no agenda show. 20 00:01:00,990 --> 00:01:05,310 And my Surface Pro six, which I like very much has been not only 21 00:01:05,310 --> 00:01:10,320 does the studio stuff, it kept going into some reboot loop but 22 00:01:10,320 --> 00:01:15,000 a really ugly one where it decides to show some, like a 23 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:18,300 little text at the bottom of the screen and kind of like a 24 00:01:18,600 --> 00:01:21,780 magnified fuzzy font. You know, you know, 25 00:01:21,780 --> 00:01:23,790 that is the windows way. 26 00:01:23,820 --> 00:01:26,010 You know, when that happens, you know, you're at low level 27 00:01:26,010 --> 00:01:28,440 windows shit, right? They're like, Oh, God, 28 00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:31,530 the old dos is talking to me. Anyway, 29 00:01:31,530 --> 00:01:34,950 so yeah, the went the windows way is to tell you that there's 30 00:01:34,950 --> 00:01:39,150 lots of things wrong, but then not actually do anything to fix 31 00:01:39,150 --> 00:01:42,960 it. So right, you have to go in there yourself and manually run. 32 00:01:43,290 --> 00:01:47,370 Check disk. Yes. Even though that would be super easy for 33 00:01:47,370 --> 00:01:53,520 Windows to run itself. Me. Linux, Linux says, oh, add some 34 00:01:53,520 --> 00:01:57,510 Roman file system. I'll run fsck. But Windows is like, hey, 35 00:01:57,510 --> 00:01:59,310 there's something wrong with the file system. Good luck. 36 00:01:59,430 --> 00:02:03,720 Yeah. Well, then I really appreciate it. And hopefully, it 37 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:07,080 was, I think, I think it is I think that internal drive it 38 00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:10,440 wasn't it once I filled it all the way up with an audio 39 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:15,720 recording by mistake, selected the wrong, the wrong drive. And, 40 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:18,240 and you know, you know what happens when your drive runs out 41 00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:22,620 of space? That's fun. It's like, machine starts you know, Windows 42 00:02:22,620 --> 00:02:28,140 Start floating. I mean, that maybe that made some bad 43 00:02:28,140 --> 00:02:29,460 sectors. Is that possible? 44 00:02:30,150 --> 00:02:33,330 I mean, yeah, well, it's, you're in the land of the unknown. Once 45 00:02:33,330 --> 00:02:35,820 you run out of space. You have no idea 46 00:02:35,820 --> 00:02:39,270 why am I even asking? reminder if you're listening to us on the 47 00:02:39,270 --> 00:02:43,680 Sphinx chat app, crank up those value sliders please you stingy 48 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:45,480 bitches crank it up. 49 00:02:46,650 --> 00:02:48,240 He goes all the way to goes to 50 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:52,950 100. And now just say what is Bitcoin now we dip below 17,000. 51 00:02:52,950 --> 00:02:56,730 So yeah, you need to you need to peg that stuff. For the value 52 00:02:56,730 --> 00:02:57,360 about it. Yeah, I 53 00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:59,370 bought I bought three or four bitcoins yesterday, just to make 54 00:02:59,370 --> 00:03:01,620 sure we're buying the dip. 55 00:03:02,580 --> 00:03:08,940 Man I've been held deep in while I set up a lightning node for 56 00:03:08,940 --> 00:03:12,390 podcasting. Next, you know, I know what I want, which is on 57 00:03:12,390 --> 00:03:15,840 voltage.io, which is fantastic. You know, you literally can only 58 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:17,970 set it up and then you can just get your credentials and you 59 00:03:17,970 --> 00:03:21,180 have to manage everything remotely, which is the way it 60 00:03:21,180 --> 00:03:27,210 should be anacharis, macaroons, exactly. So there's this and I 61 00:03:27,210 --> 00:03:33,630 upgraded my own node to was it raspy Blitz one dot six dot one, 62 00:03:33,630 --> 00:03:37,710 which is another harrowing experience where you where you 63 00:03:37,710 --> 00:03:45,180 literally have to burn a, a, an SD card and SD card. Yeah, you 64 00:03:45,180 --> 00:03:48,030 burn the SD card. You take the old one out, you put the new one 65 00:03:48,030 --> 00:03:52,650 in, and then magically, everything reappears. But it 66 00:03:52,650 --> 00:03:56,970 doesn't reappear right away. There's this staff install 67 00:03:56,970 --> 00:03:59,730 process, which Luckily, you can monitor, they give you a little 68 00:03:59,730 --> 00:04:04,260 instruction like oh, tail minus n, you know, 1000 minus F. And 69 00:04:04,260 --> 00:04:07,530 here's your log file, so you can watch it that finally all work. 70 00:04:08,010 --> 00:04:11,160 So that gave me Thunder hub. I'm getting to a point here. Thunder 71 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:14,610 hub is this reporting software, which has promised Eric our back 72 00:04:14,610 --> 00:04:18,480 office, our partner in back office, I promised him start 73 00:04:18,480 --> 00:04:22,320 running reports, you know, because it's, I mean, really in 74 00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:27,450 the fees and the 1% split that we received from the podcasts on 75 00:04:27,450 --> 00:04:30,690 the index note, it's may be 15 bucks or something. It's quite 76 00:04:30,690 --> 00:04:33,840 low, but it's going at once, you know, once a Toshi wants to 77 00:04:33,840 --> 00:04:37,050 Toshi a minute. So it's still incredible. And 78 00:04:37,500 --> 00:04:38,730 Nick wolf has a stacking, 79 00:04:38,970 --> 00:04:42,960 that's totally stacking. So I run the report, and I can run it 80 00:04:42,960 --> 00:04:46,050 on my own node fine, but every single time and I'm just trying 81 00:04:46,050 --> 00:04:52,770 to run Nov, receive payments, and it won't do it. And so I hop 82 00:04:52,770 --> 00:04:55,890 on with Graham from voltage and I guess he knows the thunder hub 83 00:04:55,890 --> 00:04:59,580 guys. So now we're like telephone, down the line. He 84 00:04:59,580 --> 00:05:04,350 says Do you know how many transactions you have? So yeah, 85 00:05:04,350 --> 00:05:08,100 I can get that number. Let me see. I said 9800, the thunder 86 00:05:08,100 --> 00:05:11,190 hub guys went, Oh, you broke our software, we have to completely 87 00:05:11,190 --> 00:05:14,250 retool, there's no way we can, we have to do something 88 00:05:14,250 --> 00:05:17,340 different with timeouts. And under the hood, there has to be 89 00:05:17,340 --> 00:05:19,650 a whole new upgrade just to handle the amount of 90 00:05:19,650 --> 00:05:20,970 transactions we have. 91 00:05:21,270 --> 00:05:26,250 The the amount of software that you break, you're breaking on a 92 00:05:26,250 --> 00:05:27,450 weekly basis 93 00:05:27,450 --> 00:05:31,170 is incredible. I'm just like a bull in a china shop, man. 94 00:05:31,500 --> 00:05:38,190 You're the you're like the QA guys. wet dream. You break break 95 00:05:38,190 --> 00:05:40,260 stuff, you don't mean like you broke your breaking stuff, two 96 00:05:40,260 --> 00:05:41,820 levels down the chain. I know. 97 00:05:44,220 --> 00:05:44,970 Well, I love it. 98 00:05:45,000 --> 00:05:48,180 I didn't break it. By myself. You know, the concept means this 99 00:05:48,180 --> 00:05:51,780 proves that what we're doing is truly on the cutting edge. 100 00:05:51,780 --> 00:05:55,710 Because I guess no one ever expected anybody to have, you 101 00:05:55,710 --> 00:05:59,850 know, almost 10,000 transactions in a month. That would be crazy. 102 00:06:00,420 --> 00:06:01,530 But when you think about 103 00:06:01,829 --> 00:06:04,499 it, what's gonna get really great is when we break all of 104 00:06:04,499 --> 00:06:05,249 lightning all and 105 00:06:06,630 --> 00:06:10,080 I'm a little concerned, I have to be honest. I'm seeing I'm 106 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:13,740 reading about some limitations here and there. So a little 107 00:06:13,740 --> 00:06:13,980 worried 108 00:06:13,980 --> 00:06:14,370 about that. 109 00:06:14,490 --> 00:06:18,960 It'll be a dynamite dynamite ride for sure. We'll see where 110 00:06:18,960 --> 00:06:22,710 it ends. But this is a podcasting 2.0 meeting of the 111 00:06:22,710 --> 00:06:26,850 Board. As I said earlier for November 2017. Had a good 112 00:06:26,910 --> 00:06:28,080 Thanksgiving Day. 113 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:33,600 Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, we had to have some dinner and chilled out 114 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:34,560 it was good and extended 115 00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:36,240 family or just your own family. 116 00:06:36,899 --> 00:06:42,899 We went to my parents house for for a little while and ate with 117 00:06:43,049 --> 00:06:46,409 mashed up in and all this stuff. So 118 00:06:46,469 --> 00:06:50,789 Oh, you messed up indoors. Yeah, yeah. Well, they're probably in 119 00:06:50,789 --> 00:06:51,929 the risk group, I guess. 120 00:06:52,500 --> 00:06:55,710 Yeah. My dad, my dad's in the 70s. And so we're, we're trying 121 00:06:55,710 --> 00:06:58,710 to be careful for everybody involved. And yeah, and you 122 00:06:58,710 --> 00:07:02,040 know, cuz I had it and it's, it's clearly touched me. So I'm 123 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:04,650 just trying to Yeah, to keep everybody safe. 124 00:07:05,190 --> 00:07:08,280 Yes, indeed. And you survived. So nice. I did. I'm 125 00:07:08,280 --> 00:07:09,450 glad I came 126 00:07:09,450 --> 00:07:11,280 out stronger than before. I could not 127 00:07:11,280 --> 00:07:13,920 imagine how many forms would have to fill out. It'd be so 128 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:14,460 annoying. 129 00:07:15,779 --> 00:07:18,989 I did not come out stronger than before the scrape currently 130 00:07:18,989 --> 00:07:20,699 drinking tea does in the coffee. 131 00:07:20,730 --> 00:07:24,750 Yeah, no, it takes a while. For recuperation is not just two 132 00:07:24,750 --> 00:07:26,940 weeks, it can last a bit. It can linger. 133 00:07:27,420 --> 00:07:27,960 Whatever. 134 00:07:28,230 --> 00:07:32,310 Um, before we get to our guest today. Do we have any open 135 00:07:32,310 --> 00:07:35,190 things we need to discuss other than maybe I would like to start 136 00:07:35,190 --> 00:07:39,090 off about that. And thank you, and comic strip blogger and 137 00:07:39,090 --> 00:07:43,590 drunk Plato, and anyone else who helped create the apps page, 138 00:07:43,740 --> 00:07:47,850 which is starting to look really good. And we have a URL for that 139 00:07:47,850 --> 00:07:53,670 new podcast? app.com. You know, spread that around. Because you 140 00:07:53,670 --> 00:07:56,550 look at this page, like holy crap. There's a lot going on 141 00:07:56,550 --> 00:08:00,720 with this podcasting. 2.0 It looks really nice. It's full, 142 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:01,470 full 143 00:08:02,010 --> 00:08:03,000 idea. Yeah, 144 00:08:03,030 --> 00:08:05,760 it's cool. It's very exciting. And you know, pretty soon we're 145 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:08,100 gonna have to add podcasts that are completely compliant. And 146 00:08:08,100 --> 00:08:12,420 we'll have to have a badge. badge, we need a badge that 147 00:08:12,420 --> 00:08:16,470 people can put on their on their podcast sites, podcast. 148 00:08:17,550 --> 00:08:20,220 I've heard it referred to as a pill, like a pill bag or 149 00:08:20,220 --> 00:08:22,410 something like that. Well, we need one of one of those things, 150 00:08:22,410 --> 00:08:22,860 whatever 151 00:08:22,860 --> 00:08:29,370 it does, it has to link back to us. Do you remember the top five 152 00:08:29,370 --> 00:08:34,050 of the internet way back when it was like you're in the top five 153 00:08:34,050 --> 00:08:36,660 of the internet and then people would get you know, get these 154 00:08:36,750 --> 00:08:40,140 was like top 100 or something. But you could get it you can get 155 00:08:40,140 --> 00:08:44,190 a top 10 or top five. And this is back. Just as the web is 156 00:08:44,190 --> 00:08:47,670 coming out. We're still using mosaic browsers browsers, no 157 00:08:47,670 --> 00:08:52,020 Netscape. And, and everyone was so you know, it was kind of 158 00:08:52,020 --> 00:08:55,470 like, oh, we're officially one of the top 100 websites Reebok 159 00:08:55,470 --> 00:08:59,070 my client, I'm like, Okay, I guess like we want it on our 160 00:08:59,100 --> 00:09:01,830 own. We want it on our site, we want to display that it was just 161 00:09:01,830 --> 00:09:05,940 some dude who just set up some some website. And he gave 162 00:09:05,940 --> 00:09:08,460 everyone this code and everyone was in the top hundred, 163 00:09:08,460 --> 00:09:12,360 essentially. And it all, you know, loop back to his, his his 164 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:13,080 website, 165 00:09:13,230 --> 00:09:16,950 it's the top 40 under 40. Yeah, whatever that. whatever that 166 00:09:16,950 --> 00:09:19,620 thing is called is like, yeah, pay me to be in this book, 167 00:09:19,950 --> 00:09:23,400 one of the top 40 Well, then I'll get to that in a second. 168 00:09:23,730 --> 00:09:29,760 Okay. What else? We you've been close. Here's what I think 169 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:32,970 you've been doing. I know you've been coding stuff. I know you've 170 00:09:32,970 --> 00:09:36,600 been re writing things and probably making things more 171 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:40,950 efficient. That's under the hood. And then on the surface, 172 00:09:41,010 --> 00:09:45,810 you've probably done some more cleaning up of namespace stuff 173 00:09:45,810 --> 00:09:47,040 if I'm guessing, right? 174 00:09:47,579 --> 00:09:51,959 Yeah, I'm continuing to bounce between between three like three 175 00:09:51,959 --> 00:09:55,919 different repos, essentially. So we're at the main podcast index 176 00:09:55,919 --> 00:10:01,889 stuff, just adding feed, you know, adding features and Keep 177 00:10:02,579 --> 00:10:05,549 doing some aggregator stuff. And then some some new feature 178 00:10:05,549 --> 00:10:08,069 stuff, I keep kind of ping pong back and forth between that 179 00:10:08,069 --> 00:10:15,029 because the aggregator needs, it needs constant care, some kind 180 00:10:15,029 --> 00:10:17,699 of pull, you know, doing that stuff all the time, that's 181 00:10:17,699 --> 00:10:20,489 always sort of background radiation, and then added some 182 00:10:20,489 --> 00:10:23,429 features, with the new tags and such. And then I'll bounce over 183 00:10:23,429 --> 00:10:29,159 to the namespace repo and try to clean that up. And also, I 184 00:10:29,189 --> 00:10:33,509 actually had a meeting and we talked about this. A little bit 185 00:10:33,509 --> 00:10:36,329 later, I had a meeting, phone meeting with the guys from pod 186 00:10:36,329 --> 00:10:40,589 chaser, about about the person tag, and how to try to get some 187 00:10:40,589 --> 00:10:45,269 movement momentum on that nicely. Yeah. And then you're 188 00:10:45,269 --> 00:10:45,419 gonna 189 00:10:45,420 --> 00:10:49,830 be you're gonna be interviewed for this, I think. No, no, no, I 190 00:10:49,830 --> 00:10:51,840 thought you'd want to do an interview soon. 191 00:10:52,050 --> 00:10:55,740 Oh, no. Well, that's, that's gonna be on Frederick Norman's 192 00:10:55,950 --> 00:10:59,850 show. He's the guy that made the podcast, the captors app for 193 00:10:59,850 --> 00:11:03,330 Mac. Ah, so that's something different. Yeah. Okay. Okay. 194 00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:06,840 He's gonna have, we're gonna have a chit chat. Mm hmm. But 195 00:11:06,990 --> 00:11:11,370 then also just working on the, on the website on the apps page 196 00:11:11,370 --> 00:11:13,830 and stuff. I've been doing that a little bit. So I'm just kind 197 00:11:13,830 --> 00:11:16,260 of bouncing around all over. It's a little. It's a little 198 00:11:16,410 --> 00:11:18,600 schizophrenia. At times. I feel like I need to take that 199 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:21,270 medicine where we're at night where you hear the voices or 200 00:11:21,270 --> 00:11:21,630 whatever. 201 00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:26,760 I don't think you really want to be taken that man No, I don't 202 00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:27,090 want to 203 00:11:27,510 --> 00:11:32,700 complete things. But it's just bouncing. A lot of bounce. And I 204 00:11:32,700 --> 00:11:37,050 never feel like I'm actually getting very far on any one 205 00:11:37,050 --> 00:11:39,630 thing. But then I look back and I made some progress. 206 00:11:40,020 --> 00:11:44,820 Yeah, I've been I've been successfully publishing with the 207 00:11:44,820 --> 00:11:48,510 new tags haven't gotten a lot of uptake on the community 208 00:11:48,510 --> 00:11:53,880 chapters. I've only to be fair, I only asked for it once, like a 209 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:57,090 week ago on no agenda. And I did have some people drop by and I 210 00:11:57,090 --> 00:12:00,450 guess they took the effort to get the hyper catcher app and 211 00:12:00,450 --> 00:12:06,540 then set a couple of a couple of chapter markers. But nothing so 212 00:12:06,540 --> 00:12:10,170 far on the one from from yesterday. So happy to see I 213 00:12:10,170 --> 00:12:12,960 that's why I need the badge. Man. I needed to say podcasting 214 00:12:12,960 --> 00:12:15,690 2.0 compliant, sort of sort of 215 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:16,800 a badge. You don't know. 216 00:12:16,829 --> 00:12:18,269 Yes. No badge like 217 00:12:18,269 --> 00:12:21,029 you know what to do. That's just that's just a that's just a 218 00:12:21,029 --> 00:12:24,269 crappy 1.0 podcast, so I can't do anything with it. 219 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:28,140 Now you also did some work on on a really cool search. 220 00:12:29,400 --> 00:12:34,260 Yeah, yeah. The really cool I did. I made what I thought was a 221 00:12:34,260 --> 00:12:36,870 really cool search. And then James Cridland told me all about 222 00:12:36,870 --> 00:12:37,920 the ways that it's not 223 00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:42,000 the Australian peat in your cornflakes? 224 00:12:43,620 --> 00:12:48,090 No, nice. He was, he had a good point, which so I made a person 225 00:12:48,090 --> 00:12:51,300 search. People search or whatever you want to call it. 226 00:12:51,330 --> 00:12:55,590 Yeah. And, you know, but he made a good point. He said, Well, you 227 00:12:55,590 --> 00:12:58,770 know, until we get the person tag finalized and get get a lot 228 00:12:58,770 --> 00:13:03,000 of person tags out there. You know, this might work. But once 229 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:08,070 you this also may delay the adoption of the tags, you know, 230 00:13:08,670 --> 00:13:12,060 so I think he's right. And it gives people a reason, if you're 231 00:13:12,060 --> 00:13:15,240 doing these searches already, it gives people reason to, to not 232 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:18,300 feel like they have to do it. Well, that works. But no, but 233 00:13:18,300 --> 00:13:21,990 he's right. So I think I mean, I'm gonna leave it there for 234 00:13:21,990 --> 00:13:25,830 now. And it'll, you know, it worked. But then once the person 235 00:13:25,830 --> 00:13:29,790 tag in, like, officially launches, I'm sorry, I'm 236 00:13:29,790 --> 00:13:32,550 still raising my hand hoping I can turn that from person to 237 00:13:32,550 --> 00:13:34,710 credits, but I don't think I'm gonna get anywhere. 238 00:13:36,900 --> 00:13:39,150 I don't know. I don't know. Maybe we can ask, 239 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:41,670 or is that a separate? Is that a separate tag? 240 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:43,860 A lot of hope not. 241 00:13:46,620 --> 00:13:49,320 It's this one's been hard enough. I don't Oh, it's not a 242 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:50,010 separate tag. 243 00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:58,740 I was talking to Roy from breeze, the breeze wallet. And 244 00:13:58,740 --> 00:14:01,440 he wants to know if there was an end point, which I I'm pretty 245 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:08,490 sure there isn't. But if one can be created, that outputs feeds 246 00:14:08,490 --> 00:14:13,380 that have or Yeah, returns IDs, I guess podcasts? Are these 247 00:14:13,740 --> 00:14:15,960 feeds that have the value block. 248 00:14:17,010 --> 00:14:18,090 Like the only the 249 00:14:18,450 --> 00:14:20,760 only the only the feeds that have the value block? 250 00:14:20,970 --> 00:14:24,510 Oh, yeah, that's easy. That's that's 15 minutes of which, 251 00:14:24,510 --> 00:14:28,500 which then led me to think, wouldn't that perhaps be a way 252 00:14:28,500 --> 00:14:34,530 to showcase the namespace on the apps page, if we had we could 253 00:14:34,530 --> 00:14:39,840 surface podcasts, maybe even next to each piece of 254 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:42,270 functionality. You know what I'm what I'm getting at what I'm 255 00:14:42,270 --> 00:14:45,810 getting at, I'd love to see some other podcasts who do chapters 256 00:14:45,810 --> 00:14:49,890 who do transcripts who have clips, just you know, just to 257 00:14:50,130 --> 00:14:54,600 fool around and see what it's like and maybe get some ideas. 258 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:55,320 The same 259 00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:57,720 thing, essentially the same thing as the apps page, but just 260 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:02,190 for fades. Bingo. That's it. Hear the fades that the support 261 00:15:02,190 --> 00:15:04,530 locked transcript. You know, 262 00:15:04,530 --> 00:15:08,670 we'll call it we'll call it the podcasting. 2.0 certified page 263 00:15:08,699 --> 00:15:10,559 certified certified. Yes. 264 00:15:12,780 --> 00:15:13,920 Okay, a bag. 265 00:15:14,850 --> 00:15:18,120 Maybe you're certified and you can get your badge right there. 266 00:15:18,180 --> 00:15:18,660 Yes. 267 00:15:19,020 --> 00:15:19,470 I like it. 268 00:15:19,500 --> 00:15:23,130 Maybe some code so anybody can copy the badge. Print your own 269 00:15:23,130 --> 00:15:26,880 certificate and stick it on your wall. It's almost like Archer 270 00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:31,290 Daniels Midland prize. No, wait, what does that what does the guy 271 00:15:31,290 --> 00:15:32,430 always do the cars? 272 00:15:33,450 --> 00:15:34,560 cars? Yeah, 273 00:15:34,559 --> 00:15:35,999 they always give the 274 00:15:36,540 --> 00:15:39,450 Oh yeah, the JD Power JD Power award. 275 00:15:40,350 --> 00:15:43,350 Which is like the biggest. Like you can buy that? I think. 276 00:15:43,710 --> 00:15:48,090 Yes. I think a JD Power award at top secret. You can buy ours 277 00:15:48,090 --> 00:15:53,190 too. If you want. If you want to get podcasting 2.0 certified, 278 00:15:53,250 --> 00:15:56,040 but not actually do anything. There you go take your money. 279 00:15:56,070 --> 00:15:58,140 We'll take your money. We'll take your SATs. Exactly. 280 00:15:58,140 --> 00:16:01,980 Yeah. Well, someone who I think is pretty much completely 281 00:16:02,010 --> 00:16:07,140 podcasting. 2.0 certified Austin Redis. resident and I'm pretty 282 00:16:07,140 --> 00:16:11,280 sure he calls himself the CEO of fireside Mr. five by five Dan 283 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:12,000 Benjamin. 284 00:16:13,830 --> 00:16:15,750 Hey, guys, thanks so much for me on. 285 00:16:15,809 --> 00:16:16,799 Hey, Dan, how you doing 286 00:16:16,799 --> 00:16:20,609 man? doing really good. You know, it's a little rainy here 287 00:16:20,609 --> 00:16:23,399 in Austin, but I can't complain about it. I'm actually coming to 288 00:16:23,399 --> 00:16:26,249 you live and direct from my garage instead of my little 289 00:16:26,249 --> 00:16:26,819 studio. 290 00:16:27,299 --> 00:16:28,799 Sounds fantastic. 291 00:16:29,309 --> 00:16:33,149 Well, that's all that's all you That's all? Yeah. Well, you're 292 00:16:33,149 --> 00:16:37,109 processing. It's the amazing, you know, app posts a few doing 293 00:16:37,109 --> 00:16:38,309 post to make me sound better. 294 00:16:38,370 --> 00:16:41,640 I don't do crap in posts. There's no posts, ever. 295 00:16:42,150 --> 00:16:46,380 I refuse. Dan, we call this the board meeting. Because the only 296 00:16:46,650 --> 00:16:48,570 the only time we talk, we talk well, thank 297 00:16:48,570 --> 00:16:51,000 thank you for allowing me to sit and I appreciate that. 298 00:16:51,030 --> 00:16:54,300 Well, I'm wondering what you will I mean, do you? Do you call 299 00:16:54,300 --> 00:17:04,170 it are you like the, like the corporate lawyer or? My dad says 300 00:17:04,170 --> 00:17:06,840 that a consultant is somebody did you hand your watch to so 301 00:17:06,840 --> 00:17:07,830 they can tell you what time it is? 302 00:17:09,660 --> 00:17:13,410 I would say Dan is an assessor at the at the board meeting, you 303 00:17:13,410 --> 00:17:16,560 know, we like sesor. Yes, you assess you assess what's going 304 00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:17,310 on that day, 305 00:17:17,309 --> 00:17:21,329 I did, I did want to chime in at about about the the person tag 306 00:17:22,379 --> 00:17:26,309 or credits tag as you as you prefer. The one hesitation I've 307 00:17:26,309 --> 00:17:29,219 heard from people about it is that, although it's optional, 308 00:17:29,219 --> 00:17:32,819 you include an AI and you should include the email, see the 309 00:17:32,819 --> 00:17:37,499 email, part of that tag. And there are a lot of people who 310 00:17:37,499 --> 00:17:39,719 had said, Well, I don't want my email address showing up in 311 00:17:39,719 --> 00:17:42,689 there because it's it's in a public feed, which of course is 312 00:17:42,689 --> 00:17:46,559 breakable, which means your email address is now exposed in 313 00:17:46,559 --> 00:17:50,099 a horrible way. But whose isn't? But I think that's the one thing 314 00:17:50,099 --> 00:17:53,549 about it. So when I, when I implemented the tag, I 315 00:17:53,549 --> 00:17:58,679 implemented it and just left the email field blank. But that 316 00:17:58,679 --> 00:18:01,919 seems counterproductive. Like it should be in their eyes. So 317 00:18:01,949 --> 00:18:03,149 maybe, you know, you have to have an 318 00:18:04,350 --> 00:18:08,850 interesting so. So I hadn't even thought about the email part of 319 00:18:08,850 --> 00:18:13,080 it. And as far as I know, it's only been kind of discussed as a 320 00:18:13,830 --> 00:18:16,380 think just as a way to search more accurately. 321 00:18:16,409 --> 00:18:18,959 Well, it's a much better way to search via email address, then 322 00:18:18,989 --> 00:18:23,099 then via a name. You know, but so i i think it needs to be 323 00:18:23,099 --> 00:18:26,219 there. But I don't know if that means we encourage people to use 324 00:18:26,219 --> 00:18:27,749 an alternate email or well 325 00:18:27,750 --> 00:18:31,920 see, this is this is Dave, pay attention because here comes the 326 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:38,640 short, surefire way to identify someone is put their name and 327 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:42,990 their node ID their public key, that's what you need. And then 328 00:18:42,990 --> 00:18:45,360 you can call it a credit. You know, I don't care call it 329 00:18:45,360 --> 00:18:48,030 people as long as that's the identifier everybody has is 330 00:18:48,030 --> 00:18:49,320 identified by a node. 331 00:18:50,250 --> 00:18:56,760 That is the person the person tag. Is that that doesn't have 332 00:18:56,760 --> 00:18:57,930 an email listed in it though. 333 00:18:57,959 --> 00:19:03,239 Well, Dan says it on your, on your GitHub page implemented in 334 00:19:04,260 --> 00:19:05,220 Kershaw that 335 00:19:05,550 --> 00:19:10,320 it has it has a it has a URL and it has an email in there if I if 336 00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:11,850 I'm remembering correctly, but you 337 00:19:13,140 --> 00:19:16,500 don't say that may have them it will see your but you're in 338 00:19:16,530 --> 00:19:21,870 you're in the realm now. Dan of of unfine alized tags here. 339 00:19:21,870 --> 00:19:22,140 Yeah, 340 00:19:22,170 --> 00:19:24,240 I know you're right on the edge. 341 00:19:25,619 --> 00:19:26,249 code base. 342 00:19:27,060 --> 00:19:30,960 Yeah, that's always a it's it's dangerous to use my finalized 343 00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:34,650 code. So your way out. 344 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:39,030 Thanks for the warning now. Yeah, no, I mean, I'm trying to 345 00:19:39,030 --> 00:19:42,000 keep up with you guys. I def I implemented everything in 1.0. 346 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:45,900 And I've implemented some of this stuff in the or the phase, 347 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:49,170 the first phase and the second phase. I'm trying to keep up 348 00:19:49,860 --> 00:19:51,300 with what y'all are doing but 349 00:19:51,660 --> 00:19:54,300 yeah, sorry for the sorry for the for the breakneck speed on 350 00:19:54,300 --> 00:19:55,050 that kind of stuff. But 351 00:19:55,050 --> 00:19:57,960 no, I love it. I get it and keeps me on my toes a little bit 352 00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:01,260 and like the chapters with the separate Separate JSON file that 353 00:20:01,260 --> 00:20:04,800 was fun. I like that you're using all these good standards 354 00:20:04,800 --> 00:20:07,560 out there, it makes me happy, and it's easy to implement. So 355 00:20:07,560 --> 00:20:10,260 far the stuff that you've done has been like really cool and 356 00:20:10,260 --> 00:20:12,540 really, really good to implement. So, you know, 357 00:20:12,570 --> 00:20:15,210 when when you're deciding what to implement on that kind of 358 00:20:15,210 --> 00:20:20,280 thing. I feel like, you know, it's really, here's the way I 359 00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:24,090 see the landscape. And you tell me, what you think about this is 360 00:20:24,090 --> 00:20:27,780 that there's, you know, you have these mega large hosting 361 00:20:27,780 --> 00:20:31,980 companies, who they're just, you know, a lot of that they're on 362 00:20:31,980 --> 00:20:35,220 autopilot most of the time. And then, you know, you have 363 00:20:35,220 --> 00:20:40,980 smaller, hungry, hosting companies like fireside that are 364 00:20:40,980 --> 00:20:45,300 trying to, you know, the all the all of these sorts of things 365 00:20:45,330 --> 00:20:48,450 that can innovate and move podcasting forward. I mean, for 366 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:53,370 for a company, the size of fireside, it seems like, that's 367 00:20:53,370 --> 00:20:57,960 just a, you know, a way to to innovate and differentiate, 368 00:20:57,990 --> 00:21:01,950 differentiate yourself and help your customers. Whereas somebody 369 00:21:01,950 --> 00:21:03,960 like me, you know, like a Lipson, or something like that 370 00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:06,780 this or an anchor this humongous, they probably don't 371 00:21:06,780 --> 00:21:11,820 feel the same. You need to innovate at a rate, like a 372 00:21:11,820 --> 00:21:14,730 fireside does that. Is that fair to say? 373 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:19,380 I mean, the part about firesides definitely true. You know, the 374 00:21:19,380 --> 00:21:25,320 thing for me, is, we're very much trying all the time. You 375 00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:27,810 know, the important thing, just to add to what you said is it 376 00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:30,780 for us anyway, it's not always to be first in coming out with 377 00:21:30,780 --> 00:21:33,000 something, although that's kind of cool. Like being able to say 378 00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:36,120 we're the first implement something that's cool. But so 379 00:21:36,120 --> 00:21:38,550 many of the tags that you guys are creating, and so much of 380 00:21:38,550 --> 00:21:42,330 what I love about what you guys have built is that it's focused 381 00:21:42,330 --> 00:21:44,880 on the community. It's focused on the podcast and community. 382 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:48,570 And that's what I really care about. Because like, you know, I 383 00:21:48,570 --> 00:21:55,200 started podcasting in 2006. And I went full time in 2008. And so 384 00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:59,070 like, this is community I really, truly care about. And so 385 00:21:59,070 --> 00:22:02,190 anything that I do in fireside, it's always, my first thought 386 00:22:02,190 --> 00:22:06,510 is, how is this moving things forward in a positive way? How 387 00:22:06,510 --> 00:22:09,360 are we doing something and or whatever, when we implement a 388 00:22:09,360 --> 00:22:13,440 feature? I want it to be because that feature makes sense for 389 00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:17,070 podcasting. And that's obviously what you guys are doing. And so, 390 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:20,550 yeah, I think it's easy for you know, you mentioned libsyn, for 391 00:22:20,550 --> 00:22:24,450 them to kind of say what, like, we're we're chugging along and 392 00:22:24,570 --> 00:22:28,470 we get people from switching from libsyn, or anchor all the 393 00:22:28,470 --> 00:22:29,490 time all the time. 394 00:22:29,550 --> 00:22:31,710 I'm hearing a lot about this, Dan, if you don't mind me 395 00:22:31,710 --> 00:22:32,340 asking, yeah, 396 00:22:32,340 --> 00:22:32,880 of course, is 397 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:36,600 this a current trend? Or is it just because we happen to be in 398 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:39,090 kind of in the middle of things that we see it more, because it 399 00:22:39,090 --> 00:22:43,050 just feels like I'm hearing more people say, Oh, I'm just gonna, 400 00:22:43,110 --> 00:22:46,320 you know, switch? Seems like people are pretty cavalier about 401 00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:46,650 that. 402 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:50,580 Yeah, I agree with you. You're right. And I think I think the 403 00:22:50,580 --> 00:22:54,000 driving factor for it is that once people start to realize 404 00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:57,060 that there are other things out there, they're, they're ready to 405 00:22:57,060 --> 00:23:00,540 explore, they're ready to try things out. And they're ready to 406 00:23:00,540 --> 00:23:05,670 experiment. And I think, you know, the company like libsyn, 407 00:23:05,700 --> 00:23:08,070 they don't have to do anything. But what they're doing, they 408 00:23:08,070 --> 00:23:10,800 don't have to redesign their interface to look cool. They've 409 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:13,410 got enough customers who are just there, they have their 410 00:23:13,410 --> 00:23:15,660 routine, they have their system, they check in, they upload, 411 00:23:15,660 --> 00:23:21,030 they're out. And my goal was always to try and provide more 412 00:23:21,030 --> 00:23:24,210 to make it easier for people to podcasts. Like I'm trying to 413 00:23:24,210 --> 00:23:30,300 build a tool that you want to use that is easy to use, that 414 00:23:30,300 --> 00:23:33,480 gets out of your way, but that there are tons and tons of 415 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,120 features so that if you're a pro, you can come in and you're 416 00:23:36,120 --> 00:23:38,490 like, Oh, cool. There's chapters right here, I don't need a 417 00:23:38,490 --> 00:23:42,150 separate app to embed chapters, or there's this recording notes 418 00:23:42,150 --> 00:23:44,550 page so that while I'm recording, I can type little 419 00:23:44,550 --> 00:23:47,160 notes and hit Enter. And it remembers the time codes for me 420 00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:51,210 like, all of this stuff is fun and cool that I figured out the 421 00:23:51,210 --> 00:23:54,480 way you figured stuff out is like I've been doing this for so 422 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,120 long that I've run into these stupid things that irritate me. 423 00:23:57,120 --> 00:23:59,370 And I'm like, I'm just gonna build a feature. So I don't have 424 00:23:59,370 --> 00:24:02,820 to keep doing it. But like Lipson doesn't need to do that. 425 00:24:02,820 --> 00:24:05,760 Because people are just just dropping their files off there. 426 00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:08,610 So for us, we're very much hungry. And I very much want to 427 00:24:08,910 --> 00:24:12,270 win something new, like what you guys have come out with is here. 428 00:24:12,270 --> 00:24:15,210 I yeah, I really want to support that I really want to integrate 429 00:24:15,210 --> 00:24:19,590 it because I want to use it to you know, like, I want it so 430 00:24:20,250 --> 00:24:21,900 that's kind of my motivation. 431 00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:24,330 Dan to go ahead, Dave. 432 00:24:24,690 --> 00:24:29,790 Did fireside I was gonna ask the fireside develop out of five by 433 00:24:29,790 --> 00:24:30,900 five. Is that how that was? 434 00:24:31,379 --> 00:24:33,209 I was gonna ask a very similar question. 435 00:24:33,510 --> 00:24:38,100 Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah, I had I had built when when I 436 00:24:38,100 --> 00:24:42,990 first was starting five by five, which was in 2008. I, I had 437 00:24:42,990 --> 00:24:46,350 been, you know, I had decided I wanted to try podcasting full 438 00:24:46,350 --> 00:24:51,120 time. And I was just as I was coming up with new shows to do, 439 00:24:51,510 --> 00:24:54,930 I it seemed like there was like a threshold for me that's like I 440 00:24:54,930 --> 00:24:59,400 could get X number of downloads and listeners for a specific 441 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:02,130 show. But then I was kind of hitting like a, like a glass 442 00:25:02,130 --> 00:25:06,240 ceiling of like, I can't seem to cross much past beyond this 443 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:08,970 level. So I'll just do another show, I'll get it up to that 444 00:25:08,970 --> 00:25:11,550 level. And that's how I make enough money to pay my bills. 445 00:25:11,820 --> 00:25:16,020 Yeah, so I had a handful of shows. And I found that every 446 00:25:16,020 --> 00:25:19,830 time I was doing a show, I had to go and make a new website for 447 00:25:19,830 --> 00:25:23,010 it. And I was updating a lot of them by hand. And at this time, 448 00:25:23,010 --> 00:25:28,080 again, 2008, nine, there weren't like there wasn't software out 449 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:30,360 there. I think libsyn existed, but I didn't like it. I mean, 450 00:25:30,360 --> 00:25:32,730 I'm sorry, if the libsyn guys are listening, nothing against 451 00:25:32,730 --> 00:25:35,580 them. But like, the interface sucked. And I'm a usability 452 00:25:35,580 --> 00:25:38,490 person, I spent a lot of time doing design and development and 453 00:25:38,490 --> 00:25:42,030 software development like you David's like, I care about the 454 00:25:42,030 --> 00:25:45,000 experience, I want to enjoy the software that I'm using life's 455 00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:49,410 too short for crappy software. So I, I thought, you know, 456 00:25:49,890 --> 00:25:53,520 reluctantly, I'll build my own system that will let me anytime 457 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:56,520 I want to make a new podcast or show it'll just be here. And I 458 00:25:56,520 --> 00:25:59,100 mean, I've been building software like publishing tools 459 00:25:59,100 --> 00:26:01,800 forever. So of course, it made sense that I could just build 460 00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:05,340 it. So I built it. And it ran five by five for a long time. 461 00:26:05,340 --> 00:26:08,490 And over the years of doing it, we had lots of different people 462 00:26:08,490 --> 00:26:10,830 on come and go on five by five and different hosts and 463 00:26:10,830 --> 00:26:13,110 different people. And they'd say, you know, I'd really like 464 00:26:13,110 --> 00:26:15,600 it if you had this feature that could work like this, and then 465 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:17,670 say, okay, and someone else would say, oh, 466 00:26:17,670 --> 00:26:18,300 what if what 467 00:26:18,300 --> 00:26:20,670 if you could work like this? What if you had this and sell 468 00:26:20,670 --> 00:26:24,390 right, and I build it. And so at the end of all of that long 469 00:26:24,390 --> 00:26:29,010 story short, I had a lot of really great input from really 470 00:26:29,010 --> 00:26:33,330 smart podcasters. And my own experiences to draw from it's a 471 00:26:33,540 --> 00:26:36,690 fireside was a total ground up rewrite, it wasn't like I took 472 00:26:36,750 --> 00:26:39,720 what I built for five by five and made it into something I 473 00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:42,990 thought people would want to pay for. I completely started from 474 00:26:42,990 --> 00:26:46,920 scratch. But a lot of most everything. In fact, everything 475 00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,710 that I learned from five by five and building it went into 476 00:26:49,710 --> 00:26:53,520 fireside and I'm in the process now of finally moving everything 477 00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:57,360 from five by fives ancient crappy CMS. Now, by today's 478 00:26:57,360 --> 00:27:00,420 standards, to the modern fireside, 479 00:27:00,780 --> 00:27:04,590 just real similar to the way that the bus broke, guys told us 480 00:27:04,590 --> 00:27:07,800 that they they kind of evolved, they started out with CRM, like 481 00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:10,800 making CRM software that had nothing to do with writing with 482 00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:14,490 even podcasting, but they just sort of grew their software in 483 00:27:14,490 --> 00:27:17,070 this direction over time. And the finally they're like, hey, 484 00:27:17,100 --> 00:27:18,720 we've actually got a really good base here, it's 485 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:23,100 really quite amazing how, how, for such a mature industry, 486 00:27:23,100 --> 00:27:26,640 there's really only a handful of people that have created really 487 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:31,380 good tools for the authoring. And I know a lot of focus went 488 00:27:31,380 --> 00:27:35,280 into recording, editing, processing. And that's where I 489 00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:37,920 think a lot of people really, really would just heads down. 490 00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:41,910 And then because of this chicken in the egg, decade of standstill 491 00:27:41,910 --> 00:27:45,840 of development, nothing here there was really no incentive, I 492 00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:49,530 guess, for anyone to jump into the new market. And for me, when 493 00:27:49,530 --> 00:27:52,470 we started working on these tags, and I said it, I'll just 494 00:27:52,470 --> 00:27:55,380 code it myself and like, looked at the notepad. And he went, No, 495 00:27:55,380 --> 00:28:00,150 I won't. I can't do all these escape characters. And it's it's 496 00:28:00,150 --> 00:28:04,290 a lot more than it used to be back in the day. And I just went 497 00:28:04,290 --> 00:28:08,070 looking for a simple tool that would just create an RSS feed 498 00:28:08,070 --> 00:28:13,020 just a file. It's not out there. I mean, yeah, there's a few but 499 00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:16,560 but nothing you can extend and create new tags with. So it's 500 00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:20,910 really nice to see this. This really, as you said, rapid 501 00:28:20,910 --> 00:28:24,180 development. What I haven't looked at the fireside 502 00:28:24,180 --> 00:28:27,210 interface, what what do you have for chapter creation? Because 503 00:28:27,210 --> 00:28:33,630 my, my big ask, I think is and we have one from hyper capture, 504 00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:37,590 is the ability for people to, you know, to create community 505 00:28:37,590 --> 00:28:42,480 based tags. Which it would be great if it works amongst all 506 00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:45,180 different apps, and everyone somehow pings the same thing. 507 00:28:45,180 --> 00:28:47,730 But I was just wondering what your what the current process 508 00:28:47,730 --> 00:28:52,020 is, is just very simple timeline, enter, title, URL, 509 00:28:52,020 --> 00:28:52,860 image URL. 510 00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:56,520 Yeah, very, very basic. I don't even have the image URL part 511 00:28:56,520 --> 00:29:00,930 because I built it just kind of for myself, I wasn't doing a lot 512 00:29:00,930 --> 00:29:04,320 with chapters, and people never really asked like, I'd really, 513 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,920 really try to pay attention to the fireside customer base, 514 00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:11,400 because those, they're just we have the best, I'm so lucky. We 515 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,670 just have the best customers, the best people, and they come 516 00:29:14,670 --> 00:29:17,550 up with so many ideas. And so many of the features that I've 517 00:29:17,550 --> 00:29:20,730 implemented have come from people just like in with five by 518 00:29:20,730 --> 00:29:23,430 five, just podcasters who are using it saying I wish it was 519 00:29:23,430 --> 00:29:27,090 like this, I wish I could do this chapters was not a request. 520 00:29:27,090 --> 00:29:31,350 There are not I am shocked still by how few people even use 521 00:29:31,350 --> 00:29:35,940 chapters. So the implementation that we've done is very, very 522 00:29:35,940 --> 00:29:39,060 basic. It's just you can enter in a chapter you can enter the 523 00:29:39,060 --> 00:29:43,320 time code, you can enter in a title. And I have had I said 524 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:46,260 I'll do images when people ask for them and no one is asked. 525 00:29:46,650 --> 00:29:50,640 Right and and, you know, we don't make a big stink about 526 00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,910 having chapters. It's on the you know, on the podcasts episodes 527 00:29:53,910 --> 00:29:58,260 Edit page, there's a tab that says chapters. So, you know we 528 00:29:58,260 --> 00:30:00,630 can't be more prominent really than that. Rather than having 529 00:30:00,630 --> 00:30:04,290 like a big flashing arrow pointing at it, but not a lot of 530 00:30:04,290 --> 00:30:07,500 people use it, I'm shocked at how few people use chapters or 531 00:30:07,500 --> 00:30:10,620 care about chapters. And I wanted to ask you guys like, is 532 00:30:10,620 --> 00:30:14,130 this something that's like big because your implementation of 533 00:30:14,130 --> 00:30:17,130 chapters and the way that, so for people who don't sit there 534 00:30:17,130 --> 00:30:21,210 and read the RSS feeds that are compliant with what you guys 535 00:30:21,210 --> 00:30:23,160 have built, there's a little link in there that says 536 00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:27,690 chapters. And if you follow that link, it's a JSON, JSON feed 537 00:30:27,690 --> 00:30:30,720 essentially, for that episodes, chapters perfect implementation 538 00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:34,140 best way to do it. are a lot of people using it, is this 539 00:30:34,140 --> 00:30:36,270 something you guys think is important? Or did this come from 540 00:30:36,270 --> 00:30:36,990 the community 541 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:42,240 chat chapters has been a big thing, I think amongst a small 542 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,000 group, of course, a lot of people do spend time and put 543 00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:48,570 chapters into their mp3 file, which is kind of universally 544 00:30:48,570 --> 00:30:52,950 recognized by some of the more some of the bigger apps, right, 545 00:30:52,980 --> 00:30:57,390 what got me excited are two things. One is community 546 00:30:57,390 --> 00:31:02,190 chapter. So other people tagging places in in the show, so that, 547 00:31:02,730 --> 00:31:05,370 you know, so it's Yes, exactly what it is a community, and 548 00:31:05,370 --> 00:31:09,000 then, you know, other people can go and find those chapters. But 549 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:14,430 what really got me excited was the was the image URL, because 550 00:31:15,090 --> 00:31:19,710 for me, and it works best right now, in pod friend, the web app. 551 00:31:21,390 --> 00:31:24,540 You know, you're, you're literally looking at the screen, 552 00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:28,740 and we're talking about album art, and then it just pops up at 553 00:31:28,740 --> 00:31:31,110 that very moment, you see the album mark that we're talking 554 00:31:31,110 --> 00:31:35,130 about. So to have that and to say, Okay, here's a chart, or 555 00:31:35,130 --> 00:31:38,310 here's a graph, or here's a picture, and then to be able to 556 00:31:38,310 --> 00:31:41,340 say just go ahead and take a look at your at your app screen. 557 00:31:42,030 --> 00:31:47,100 That is super, super cool to me. And there's only two apps that 558 00:31:47,100 --> 00:31:52,410 do it right now, which is hyper capture and, and pod friend, 559 00:31:52,890 --> 00:31:54,660 and I have guest addict I think that's I 560 00:31:54,660 --> 00:31:55,800 guess added does it as well. 561 00:31:56,190 --> 00:31:58,530 I believe so. Yeah. I thought they 562 00:32:00,030 --> 00:32:02,250 do they have a an image that rotates. 563 00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:04,290 I know he implemented chapters. 564 00:32:04,950 --> 00:32:07,770 Now he has chapters and he has the image but he I think he just 565 00:32:07,770 --> 00:32:11,610 displays it as a list. Okay, at the bottom, yeah, no, it's this 566 00:32:11,610 --> 00:32:14,760 this rotating kind of slideshow thing. That got me pretty 567 00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:19,140 excited. And it really is only two implementations. And one 568 00:32:19,140 --> 00:32:22,470 that's, you know, the web version, it looks sexy. I really 569 00:32:22,470 --> 00:32:22,980 like it. 570 00:32:24,450 --> 00:32:29,490 Yeah, the, the chapters that for? Well, I'm looking here in 571 00:32:29,490 --> 00:32:35,400 the database. And there's there are roughly 2100 episodes in in 572 00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:38,610 our index database that have a chapter file associated with 573 00:32:38,610 --> 00:32:42,780 them. And a lot of there's quite a few far sides in there. I'm 574 00:32:43,470 --> 00:32:46,650 looking at these URLs and there's a there's quite a few 575 00:32:46,650 --> 00:32:51,420 fireside podcasts that are using them. But they it seems like 576 00:32:52,260 --> 00:32:55,800 from what I've seen, there's dislike divide or not divide 577 00:32:55,830 --> 00:33:00,780 maybe as a spectrum there's the spectrum where people you know 578 00:33:00,780 --> 00:33:03,720 you either love chapters or you don't care anything about them 579 00:33:03,930 --> 00:33:06,930 and everybody is either on one side or the other there's like 580 00:33:06,930 --> 00:33:10,020 is very few people floating in the middle right it's like some 581 00:33:10,020 --> 00:33:12,900 people are just diehard chapter people and those are the people 582 00:33:12,900 --> 00:33:15,630 that have they were already doing chapters with like in with 583 00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:17,790 within the mp3 this is self 584 00:33:18,180 --> 00:33:21,240 they and I mean for the record if you put your own chapters in 585 00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:24,390 with other software like fireside, you can import those. 586 00:33:24,450 --> 00:33:26,940 So you can click a little import button or you can just not do 587 00:33:26,940 --> 00:33:29,970 anything and fireside won't touch them. And they still ship 588 00:33:29,970 --> 00:33:32,970 out with the chapters the same way that you did them. Oh, so 589 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:38,490 you put your mp3 in it can suck them out is Oh yeah, it'll it'll 590 00:33:38,490 --> 00:33:41,220 it'll import them if you want. Or you can just be or you just 591 00:33:41,220 --> 00:33:44,220 do nothing and they just ship out with your mp3 on touched. 592 00:33:45,090 --> 00:33:49,320 Something about the chapter spec is is okay, well, you know why? 593 00:33:49,710 --> 00:33:53,400 Why would you do a separate chapter spec it versus Okay, 594 00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:57,030 that's already available in the mp3 itself. And the one of the 595 00:33:57,030 --> 00:34:00,960 reasons that we felt it was necessary is because for exactly 596 00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,870 the same thing that you're talking about you you as a 597 00:34:03,870 --> 00:34:08,520 holster can implement. It can implement chapters, without 598 00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:12,840 having to do the heavy like a bunch of heavy audio. You know, 599 00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:16,830 you don't have to re encode or parse the file and stick them in 600 00:34:16,830 --> 00:34:19,620 the frame headers and all this kind of stuff. I mean, it's just 601 00:34:19,620 --> 00:34:22,530 so much easier to keep everything in a separate JSON 602 00:34:22,530 --> 00:34:25,530 file. It's just a supplemental checks. 603 00:34:25,650 --> 00:34:28,410 It's perfect. It's the way it should be. 604 00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:31,290 You know what I would love? I just got it before I forget, 605 00:34:31,290 --> 00:34:33,780 just got to get it out. Because I know Martin's listening. We've 606 00:34:33,780 --> 00:34:39,630 developed pod friend. I'd loved a chapter pod friend that I 607 00:34:39,630 --> 00:34:43,980 could then share as a widget one of your famous little widgets 608 00:34:43,980 --> 00:34:48,630 like the Twitter widget, and when you play that piece, if 609 00:34:48,630 --> 00:34:54,540 there's a chapter that image shows and the link shows. I 610 00:34:54,540 --> 00:34:56,580 don't know why I want it but just want to say I wanted it 611 00:34:57,990 --> 00:35:00,720 that would be so fucking cool. Like you do You could do just 612 00:35:00,720 --> 00:35:03,690 like little presentations, you know, it's like a little. Oh, 613 00:35:03,690 --> 00:35:06,090 it's kind of cool. There's so I don't know, I just feels to me 614 00:35:06,090 --> 00:35:07,920 like, there's a market for that. 615 00:35:09,210 --> 00:35:11,460 Oh, there is Adam. You're right. And but the thing is just 616 00:35:11,460 --> 00:35:13,890 listening to what you were saying how you like using 617 00:35:13,890 --> 00:35:17,100 chapters for popping up the image of the thing that you're 618 00:35:17,100 --> 00:35:19,890 talking about. There. I don't think people even realize the 619 00:35:19,890 --> 00:35:24,900 chapters can do that. A majority of podcasters out there, think 620 00:35:24,900 --> 00:35:29,130 that it's just a way to like, skip an ad or jump to the second 621 00:35:29,130 --> 00:35:30,810 half of the interview or something. They don't even 622 00:35:30,810 --> 00:35:33,990 realize that it could be like a, it could make the whole podcast 623 00:35:33,990 --> 00:35:36,300 experience more interactive. But when you're talking Wait, when 624 00:35:36,300 --> 00:35:38,580 you're talking about community chapters, you mean somebody's 625 00:35:38,580 --> 00:35:41,610 listening to it? And they could add, they could say, oh, right 626 00:35:41,610 --> 00:35:44,820 here, yeah, I want to put a essentially a marker down 627 00:35:44,820 --> 00:35:47,640 saying, This is the funny thing that this person said 628 00:35:47,700 --> 00:35:51,300 exactly, exactly. And, and so hyper capture allows you to do 629 00:35:51,300 --> 00:35:55,800 that. But it's only one app, and it's on iOS. So before, before 630 00:35:55,800 --> 00:36:00,000 we get to any, you have to have a back end running. The app has 631 00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:04,110 to have some kind of back end to store to store stores to have 632 00:36:04,110 --> 00:36:06,750 those be submitted up. And then and then when I'm playing the 633 00:36:06,750 --> 00:36:10,500 mp3, it knows that I'm playing that mp3 and shows them in my 634 00:36:10,500 --> 00:36:13,470 player, right? Yeah. And how do you stop abuse of that? Because 635 00:36:13,470 --> 00:36:14,670 eventually you get people who are gonna 636 00:36:15,299 --> 00:36:18,569 approval process. So hyper capture will just show you that 637 00:36:18,569 --> 00:36:21,329 show you the submitted chapters, and then you can approve or 638 00:36:21,329 --> 00:36:23,399 change or whatever you want before it goes right. 639 00:36:23,430 --> 00:36:24,180 Right, right, right. 640 00:36:24,299 --> 00:36:26,699 Oh, yeah, cuz of course, you know, I'm looking like, all 641 00:36:26,699 --> 00:36:30,029 right, who's gonna have a link to one of those Safari pages 642 00:36:30,029 --> 00:36:34,829 that hijacks your iPhone browser? We have to restart and 643 00:36:34,829 --> 00:36:37,859 you have to empty your history because your your Safari won't 644 00:36:37,859 --> 00:36:38,879 start anymore. 645 00:36:39,840 --> 00:36:45,930 six chapters of porn links? No. Yeah. That was your, uh, your, 646 00:36:46,350 --> 00:36:47,760 your rebeka. Dan. 647 00:36:48,090 --> 00:36:51,300 Yeah, primarily, I mean, firesides, all Ruby on Rails. 648 00:36:51,690 --> 00:36:54,900 With some other. There's some other tech in the background 649 00:36:54,900 --> 00:36:57,270 there. But primarily, that's what I've been using, just 650 00:36:57,270 --> 00:36:59,910 because I got into Ruby on Rails, right when it was brand 651 00:36:59,910 --> 00:37:03,270 new. Gosh, I don't know, whatever. More than 10 years 652 00:37:03,270 --> 00:37:08,280 ago, whenever it first came out. And I actually built I think one 653 00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:12,990 of the first if not the first, like Ruby on Rails powered CMS 654 00:37:12,990 --> 00:37:17,070 is for a for an internet magazine. And it was a really 655 00:37:17,070 --> 00:37:20,520 fun community at the time. And, and it was it was really 656 00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:23,490 different. It was really fun. And Ruby's a fun language to to 657 00:37:23,490 --> 00:37:27,270 code in. What are you guys developing? And I should know 658 00:37:27,270 --> 00:37:28,140 the answer that 659 00:37:28,410 --> 00:37:34,170 Oh, no, it's it's all over the map. It's PHP, JavaScript. Most 660 00:37:34,170 --> 00:37:40,170 mostly, mostly PHP for the for the back end of the API, in 661 00:37:40,170 --> 00:37:43,230 aggregate with the aggregators all in node j. s, 662 00:37:43,560 --> 00:37:46,560 is the Yeah, I mean, the JavaScript is like, I don't, I 663 00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:49,500 don't even think to mention it. Because it's sort of a given. 664 00:37:49,500 --> 00:37:52,170 It's like, like, you wouldn't say, Well, I use a computer to 665 00:37:52,170 --> 00:37:55,620 write code like he or she did it. I feel like that's 666 00:37:55,620 --> 00:37:57,900 JavaScript has just become ubiquitous. I don't know how 667 00:37:57,900 --> 00:38:01,050 it's possible to build an application of any kind for the 668 00:38:01,050 --> 00:38:04,860 web without it, but in the no jazz stuff is really great. And 669 00:38:04,860 --> 00:38:06,960 I think node I mean, I don't want to go down this rabbit 670 00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:11,040 hole, but I think node is is, you know, there are people who 671 00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:13,890 say, Oh, don't build it, node, build it and go build it in rust 672 00:38:13,890 --> 00:38:16,590 or whatever. But I still seem way more node than any of the 673 00:38:16,590 --> 00:38:17,070 others. 674 00:38:18,060 --> 00:38:23,850 I'm not, I don't like JavaScript is john wonder. Yeah, no, that's 675 00:38:23,850 --> 00:38:27,510 crazy. JavaScript is the language that that everybody 676 00:38:27,510 --> 00:38:30,720 uses, and depends on but everybody also hates with a 677 00:38:30,720 --> 00:38:31,290 passion. 678 00:38:31,380 --> 00:38:35,520 Everyone needs any anyone who understands good code hates 679 00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:36,270 hates it. 680 00:38:36,630 --> 00:38:39,330 Yeah. In all the in all the promises and all that kind of 681 00:38:39,330 --> 00:38:41,880 stuff. That's great. But it's still just it's still a dumpster 682 00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:43,560 fire. I mean, yeah, it really is, you 683 00:38:44,820 --> 00:38:48,570 know, I mean, but I mean, I write JavaScript code. Half the 684 00:38:48,570 --> 00:38:52,680 time. I mean, I hate I hate doing it. And like yesterday, my 685 00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:57,750 son he was using, you know, he has steam to play as games. And 686 00:38:57,900 --> 00:39:01,350 there's this, there's this thing, where I guess if you, I 687 00:39:01,350 --> 00:39:04,020 don't understand the details, but somehow you get like a game 688 00:39:04,020 --> 00:39:06,480 in your wish list that doesn't show up in your wish list 689 00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,240 anymore, but it's still there, so you get the wrong count. So 690 00:39:09,240 --> 00:39:11,580 like, it'll show you have 19 games in your wish list when you 691 00:39:11,580 --> 00:39:15,600 really only put 16 in there. So the only way to clear it out, we 692 00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:19,770 search for it. And it's some dude wrote JavaScript that you 693 00:39:19,770 --> 00:39:22,350 have to go in into a web browser, log into steam in a web 694 00:39:22,350 --> 00:39:25,950 browser, paste the JavaScript in your web browsers console, and 695 00:39:25,950 --> 00:39:28,740 it will find the list of ones. And he's like, is it safe for me 696 00:39:28,740 --> 00:39:30,900 to run this? And so last night, I'm sitting there reading 697 00:39:30,900 --> 00:39:35,400 someone else's JavaScript code, but like, I didn't even realize 698 00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:37,950 I note like, I don't I don't think about JavaScript. I don't 699 00:39:37,950 --> 00:39:40,560 even think that I know it. I don't even consider it a thing. 700 00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:42,810 It's just like of course I don't think anybody else do it. I 701 00:39:42,810 --> 00:39:45,900 don't think anybody does know it. I don't think he actually 702 00:39:45,900 --> 00:39:49,140 does know. The only guy that knows JavaScript actually knows 703 00:39:49,140 --> 00:39:51,210 it. Isn't that dude the wrote the book like JavaScript, the 704 00:39:51,210 --> 00:39:54,600 good parts, right? Whatever is called the only guy that really 705 00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:57,270 knows it. Yeah, everybody, everybody else is just it's 706 00:39:57,270 --> 00:39:59,250 just, it's just bullshit. Yep, 707 00:39:59,430 --> 00:40:00,450 no 100 Sent. 708 00:40:02,220 --> 00:40:07,620 The I was what I was wondering what? You know, in the tradition 709 00:40:07,620 --> 00:40:11,700 of interviewing, hosting companies we typically in 710 00:40:11,700 --> 00:40:14,100 our long tradition of interval hosting, 711 00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:21,510 we we have to I'm trying to figure out what Bitcoin related 712 00:40:21,510 --> 00:40:23,670 shenanigans that we can ask Dan about. It's holy. 713 00:40:25,650 --> 00:40:27,720 Yeah. Now we got to tell you something you'll never 714 00:40:27,720 --> 00:40:29,820 understand and then kick out. 715 00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:32,340 Good interview. 716 00:40:33,900 --> 00:40:37,110 Have you have you played with any of the devalue block stuff? 717 00:40:37,110 --> 00:40:37,470 Danny? We 718 00:40:37,470 --> 00:40:40,560 looked at swings chat on you that stuff. Yeah, only because 719 00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:42,870 of you guys only because what you've been talking about and 720 00:40:42,870 --> 00:40:45,240 this show and it was completely off my radar. We haven't 721 00:40:45,240 --> 00:40:48,210 implemented any of it yet. But it's definitely on my radar now, 722 00:40:48,240 --> 00:40:51,270 because of you guys. And, you know, it's the kind of thing 723 00:40:51,270 --> 00:40:55,920 that like, it's so not mean. I mean, like, it's, you guys think 724 00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:59,970 about it so much that I feel like to you, it's like, well, of 725 00:40:59,970 --> 00:41:02,550 course, this is what is important. And but then there's 726 00:41:02,550 --> 00:41:05,880 like this huge pocket of people that don't know anything about 727 00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:08,640 any of this stuff. Oh, yeah. Well, no, that's and they don't 728 00:41:08,640 --> 00:41:10,770 want to be educated and they don't want to learn about it. 729 00:41:10,770 --> 00:41:13,080 They're like, Nope, that's not I want to do anything. It's like 730 00:41:13,140 --> 00:41:14,310 the old way, you know? Well, 731 00:41:14,310 --> 00:41:18,150 the good news is, once we get a couple of shows really up and 732 00:41:18,150 --> 00:41:21,450 running, and talking about it, and there's apps to get, I mean, 733 00:41:21,450 --> 00:41:25,440 the main, the main drawback to Sphinx is fantastic. Because 734 00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:28,980 it's two way interactive, they got a lot of stuff that goes way 735 00:41:28,980 --> 00:41:32,340 above and beyond any podcast app, certainly community 736 00:41:32,340 --> 00:41:37,890 features, which is truly, truly dynamite. It doesn't scale in a 737 00:41:37,890 --> 00:41:43,440 quick manner, the way we kind of need to launch the whole idea, 738 00:41:43,770 --> 00:41:47,490 where you just have a podcast app or a couple of apps that 739 00:41:47,490 --> 00:41:52,440 anybody can use anybody, as long as you can figure out how to in 740 00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:56,250 fact, I think what Brees will do is, you know, they they they tie 741 00:41:56,250 --> 00:42:02,100 in a Fiat payment processor. And, and you can load it right 742 00:42:02,100 --> 00:42:06,420 up with, with with dollars, and then boom, you're you've got 743 00:42:06,450 --> 00:42:09,720 lightning Bitcoin, and you're off to the races. And of course, 744 00:42:09,720 --> 00:42:13,650 the app will work even if you don't have that. And that'll 745 00:42:13,650 --> 00:42:17,760 scale. So then podcasters can say, hey, check it out. And the 746 00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:19,920 way I've always seen these things roll out, and then you 747 00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:22,950 have hundreds or thousands of people who are checking it out, 748 00:42:23,130 --> 00:42:25,350 and they listen to other podcasts. And if they like it, 749 00:42:25,350 --> 00:42:27,900 they'll tell the other podcast or they listen to Hey, you 750 00:42:27,900 --> 00:42:30,810 should implement this. And then the podcast just has to go 751 00:42:30,810 --> 00:42:34,380 figure out where the how to do it what it is it kind of markets 752 00:42:34,380 --> 00:42:37,170 itself. And I have noticed that when there's money involved 753 00:42:37,170 --> 00:42:39,090 people do pay a little more attention. 754 00:42:39,720 --> 00:42:44,160 Yeah. Oh, yeah, definitely. Definitely. So and speaking of 755 00:42:44,190 --> 00:42:46,980 speaking of money, I mean, that the the things that I'm we're 756 00:42:47,010 --> 00:42:50,190 always hearing about tons and tons of people asking us this 757 00:42:50,190 --> 00:42:53,430 all the time. They want dynamic ad insertion. That's the 758 00:42:53,430 --> 00:42:56,310 biggest, that's the number one request that I get these days, 759 00:42:56,340 --> 00:42:59,430 because maybe it's because we've added all the other features 760 00:42:59,430 --> 00:43:02,580 that people are asking for except that one. And and then 761 00:43:02,580 --> 00:43:05,760 the other thing that's talked about a lot is stats and 762 00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:09,660 accurate stats. And yeah, sure, you know, in order to get the 763 00:43:09,660 --> 00:43:13,260 kinds of stats that people want, like the kind and they always 764 00:43:13,260 --> 00:43:16,620 compare it to YouTube, and I have a lot of conversations with 765 00:43:16,620 --> 00:43:21,510 people who are coming from YouTube into podcasting. And the 766 00:43:21,510 --> 00:43:25,830 thing that I hear over and over again, YouTube gives you really 767 00:43:25,830 --> 00:43:29,670 great stats, but not just stats, it shows you what your viewers 768 00:43:29,670 --> 00:43:33,120 are actually doing. Right. And I'm sure you guys have heard 769 00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:36,930 this too. But it gets the, you know, the fact that like, let's 770 00:43:36,930 --> 00:43:40,560 say you have an intro segment on your YouTube video that you do 771 00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:44,430 every time you make a video, and people you can see if people are 772 00:43:44,430 --> 00:43:46,950 watching, you're skipping over it exactly, well, here's, 773 00:43:47,340 --> 00:43:51,960 here's the great benefit of the the devalue block and the 774 00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:56,070 lightning node payments, is that what that creates is a 775 00:43:56,070 --> 00:44:01,800 transaction record that both the podcaster of course has over the 776 00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:06,180 the person who's paying has but the podcaster gets a permanent 777 00:44:07,050 --> 00:44:11,970 micro payment, which you can track beautifully over time. So 778 00:44:11,970 --> 00:44:14,670 you can and actual listening behavior because the minutes 779 00:44:14,670 --> 00:44:17,130 right now if if they don't have anything in their wallet, you're 780 00:44:17,130 --> 00:44:20,850 not going to get any payments, so you can't track it. But 781 00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:24,630 already the Sphinx app, and now they have a little extra thing, 782 00:44:24,630 --> 00:44:28,740 which is also kind of a YouTube thing or Instagram Live is you 783 00:44:28,740 --> 00:44:31,590 could hit the boost button. So if you're listening, and you're 784 00:44:31,590 --> 00:44:34,530 like, Oh, this is funny, he hit the boost button, it sends you 785 00:44:34,530 --> 00:44:38,730 know, and it's configurable. I think the default is 10 SATs, 786 00:44:38,730 --> 00:44:42,030 but most people have at higher and boom you send 100 SATs to 787 00:44:42,030 --> 00:44:47,190 the show or to whatever split is in that value block. Then you 788 00:44:47,190 --> 00:44:51,960 can go back and as the podcaster you can look at the at the 789 00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:56,490 timeline, and you can see where the boosts were. So now all of a 790 00:44:56,490 --> 00:44:59,310 sudden you have some real granular data. Oh people really 791 00:44:59,310 --> 00:45:02,550 like this because they We're boosting it. And that and that, 792 00:45:02,580 --> 00:45:06,060 by the way, will carry over into into any app that that 793 00:45:06,060 --> 00:45:09,030 implements this, they can do something very similar. So you 794 00:45:09,030 --> 00:45:14,730 have very similar to the Apple podcast Connect, you have 795 00:45:14,730 --> 00:45:17,550 listening statistics. That's wonderful. I 796 00:45:17,549 --> 00:45:20,009 mean, and the more the more we can get that. 797 00:45:20,160 --> 00:45:23,010 So you can even add, you can even say, hey, not only do you 798 00:45:23,010 --> 00:45:26,190 get micro payments, but you also get some statistics. That's all 799 00:45:26,190 --> 00:45:28,650 you need is a sample, right? You need a sample of people who are 800 00:45:28,650 --> 00:45:31,110 going to listen, and then you have kind of an idea. You can 801 00:45:31,320 --> 00:45:34,590 overlay that with your Apple Listen, stats and and 802 00:45:34,620 --> 00:45:36,180 extrapolate some good data. 803 00:45:36,779 --> 00:45:40,049 But we don't even have an accurate I mean, I know the IB 804 00:45:40,049 --> 00:45:44,519 has their spec, which I don't, I don't. I mean, it's good. And 805 00:45:44,519 --> 00:45:47,159 it's good that we have a spec, but there are some flaws with 806 00:45:47,159 --> 00:45:52,229 it. I came out with a wave. In my mind, I haven't come in No, 807 00:45:52,229 --> 00:45:54,629 I've not told anyone about it. It's just been sitting in my 808 00:45:54,629 --> 00:45:57,809 mind of a way that we could actually get just regular stats, 809 00:45:57,809 --> 00:45:59,699 I'm not even talking about listener behavior, but just 810 00:45:59,699 --> 00:46:01,109 accurate downloads. 811 00:46:02,009 --> 00:46:05,069 Really Come on, that's not possible. Dan, no one's no one's 812 00:46:05,249 --> 00:46:07,259 able to do accurate downloads get 813 00:46:07,260 --> 00:46:11,640 out of town, in order to do it, we would need participation from 814 00:46:11,700 --> 00:46:14,940 basically every podcast app, and we'll never get that we'll never 815 00:46:14,940 --> 00:46:19,110 get it and you know, but there are, there are ways to do it, we 816 00:46:19,110 --> 00:46:22,470 would just need everyone to get on board with it. And that would 817 00:46:22,470 --> 00:46:24,900 probably be about as easy as getting all the cell phone 818 00:46:24,900 --> 00:46:29,310 carriers to agree on a standard, you know, across international 819 00:46:29,310 --> 00:46:29,820 borders. 820 00:46:30,150 --> 00:46:30,720 So, 821 00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:35,460 you know, the answer is probably never, but that it's just super 822 00:46:35,460 --> 00:46:40,200 frustrating. Because for a podcaster. You know, they it's 823 00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:42,420 not it's not like they're saying, gosh, we really wish we 824 00:46:42,420 --> 00:46:44,730 knew if people were skipping through this part of the show, 825 00:46:44,940 --> 00:46:47,370 you know, maybe sort of they can kind of get that the way you're 826 00:46:47,370 --> 00:46:50,160 describing. They don't even know if their episode has ever been 827 00:46:50,160 --> 00:46:52,440 played when it's been downloaded. Or how many people 828 00:46:52,470 --> 00:46:55,530 actually really even downloaded the thing. It's and it's super 829 00:46:55,530 --> 00:46:59,670 frustrating. The funny thing is, it's always the people that we 830 00:46:59,700 --> 00:47:02,100 when we get asked questions about it, it's always the people 831 00:47:02,100 --> 00:47:05,760 with really, really small shows, relatively speaking, the people 832 00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:08,310 who have hundreds of thousands of downloads, they don't really 833 00:47:08,310 --> 00:47:11,040 care. They don't even care at that point. But it's the people 834 00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:14,280 who are like, last week, I got 51 downloads this week, I got 835 00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:14,970 48. 836 00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:20,190 And that's what I like, so much about the about the streaming 837 00:47:20,190 --> 00:47:25,110 value is right, even though it's so I'm just looking at the index 838 00:47:25,110 --> 00:47:28,440 node, and in the month of November, and this is very, 839 00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:31,890 very, very small group. Do you think Dave 2030 people maybe are 840 00:47:31,890 --> 00:47:32,550 listening? 841 00:47:33,180 --> 00:47:37,470 Yeah, it's I think it's more than we think it is. But it's it 842 00:47:37,500 --> 00:47:38,970 maybe Max 50? 843 00:47:39,540 --> 00:47:44,340 Yeah. So and by the way, that those 50 people and they're 844 00:47:44,340 --> 00:47:48,120 boosting and everything they've done have resulted in $15 to the 845 00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:52,830 index, I'm looking at that and going shit, that's 1% of 846 00:47:52,830 --> 00:47:56,880 whatever else is, is flowing. You know, that's, that's some 847 00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:59,640 real money that's flowing around amongst a small group of 848 00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:05,760 micropayments. Right. But the money doesn't even matter. Just 849 00:48:05,820 --> 00:48:09,120 Just like Click, click every minute, there's something coming 850 00:48:09,120 --> 00:48:12,480 in. And it's like, oh, my God, someone's listening right now 851 00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:17,040 they're listening right now. And then you see, like a, you see, 852 00:48:17,040 --> 00:48:20,190 like a three Satoshi come through again, the index is 1%. 853 00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:26,220 Like, someone boosted in. So you get a pretty, pretty good idea. 854 00:48:26,220 --> 00:48:30,720 Now, the reporting I have, I can't, I have no idea what 855 00:48:30,720 --> 00:48:33,690 anyone's playing but as a podcaster. And that's what I 856 00:48:33,690 --> 00:48:37,230 like about the splits is that everybody involved gets the same 857 00:48:37,230 --> 00:48:41,820 reporting. So whether you are, or at least has the same data, 858 00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:47,520 whether you're just a or just whether you get 5%, of a 859 00:48:47,520 --> 00:48:53,190 particular episode, because you did the artwork, it's still, you 860 00:48:53,190 --> 00:48:56,640 know, you get to see exactly where people were listening as 861 00:48:56,640 --> 00:49:00,120 well, or where they were, they'd like something more or less. And 862 00:49:00,120 --> 00:49:02,310 in fact, when you're talking about the artwork, you can 863 00:49:02,310 --> 00:49:05,280 probably see if people like that artwork, if they're boosting, I 864 00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:08,970 mean, this it's endless. It's very, so simple to implement. I 865 00:49:08,970 --> 00:49:11,100 mean, more or less, 866 00:49:11,339 --> 00:49:16,469 but now, Dan, how, how is your How would you characterize your 867 00:49:17,129 --> 00:49:21,959 customer base? Would you say that? Like, how much of a 868 00:49:21,959 --> 00:49:25,079 percentage of them really are really in it for monetization 869 00:49:25,079 --> 00:49:28,619 purposes? And how much are really just kind of don't care. 870 00:49:28,619 --> 00:49:31,289 They're just into it for just the fun in the experience of 871 00:49:31,289 --> 00:49:31,859 podcasting? 872 00:49:32,250 --> 00:49:34,590 That's a wonderful question. I don't know if I have a 873 00:49:34,590 --> 00:49:38,520 definitive answer on that because you know, there are so 874 00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:41,880 many different ways to monetize you can you we have a little 875 00:49:41,880 --> 00:49:45,420 feature that makes it easy for you to enter in like sponsors 876 00:49:45,420 --> 00:49:49,560 and links for sponsors, but it doesn't have any kind of there's 877 00:49:49,560 --> 00:49:51,930 no like payment system. If you're a sponsor, you don't log 878 00:49:51,930 --> 00:49:54,840 in and and like have a way to use a credit card to buy a 879 00:49:54,840 --> 00:49:58,590 sponsorship in there. We have left that up to the individuals 880 00:49:58,590 --> 00:50:03,210 to do it, but What we are rolling out is integration with 881 00:50:03,210 --> 00:50:06,300 Patreon. And integration with we've actually had integration 882 00:50:06,300 --> 00:50:08,190 with Patreon for a while Was that fun 883 00:50:08,190 --> 00:50:10,530 leads behind an extra level. 884 00:50:11,010 --> 00:50:14,340 Yeah, and it's actually the way that and we're adding in member 885 00:50:14,340 --> 00:50:18,360 full support to but the way that this works is like for example, 886 00:50:18,360 --> 00:50:21,210 I have a show that I do called roadwork, I do it with john 887 00:50:21,210 --> 00:50:26,760 rodrick out of Seattle. And we also do a bonus show every week. 888 00:50:26,790 --> 00:50:30,150 And we make a version of the episode with no sponsors in it 889 00:50:30,150 --> 00:50:34,230 available to so depending on your Patreon tier, right, you 890 00:50:34,230 --> 00:50:37,590 either get well everyone who supports us gets the bonus show. 891 00:50:38,010 --> 00:50:41,130 And then different tiers depending on what tier you are, 892 00:50:41,130 --> 00:50:43,590 you might get the sponsor this version of the show. So I'll use 893 00:50:43,590 --> 00:50:46,980 this I'll use this show as an example. What I have to do my 894 00:50:46,980 --> 00:50:52,110 workflow for this is okay, take that take the show clean, clean 895 00:50:52,110 --> 00:50:55,620 it up, make it sound good, and then publish it without the 896 00:50:55,620 --> 00:50:58,650 sponsors then publish another version of that same episode 897 00:50:58,650 --> 00:51:02,580 with the sponsors then take the after show and publish that 898 00:51:02,580 --> 00:51:05,820 version. And when I say publish, what that means is I take the 899 00:51:05,820 --> 00:51:08,910 regular sponsored version and push it up to the five by five 900 00:51:08,910 --> 00:51:12,690 CMS then I have to go log into Patreon and I have to upload the 901 00:51:12,690 --> 00:51:16,080 content for the bonus show and I've got to upload the content 902 00:51:16,080 --> 00:51:18,150 for the other show and I've got a 903 00:51:19,140 --> 00:51:22,020 coin lightning is easier. Well I believe 904 00:51:22,890 --> 00:51:26,160 but but so many people are already on Patreon and we 905 00:51:26,160 --> 00:51:30,000 already have sure all the people on Patreon so what the way we 906 00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:33,810 implemented it in a fireside is you would just upload it to 907 00:51:33,810 --> 00:51:37,830 fireside you would upload the episode to fireside and then you 908 00:51:37,830 --> 00:51:42,570 would select who in the Patreon whether all everyone gets it or 909 00:51:42,570 --> 00:51:45,780 you would select the one tier and above that get that is 910 00:51:45,780 --> 00:51:50,460 allowed to get it. And then each person gets their own private 911 00:51:50,460 --> 00:51:56,730 feed from fireside and only they have access to No, it's not 912 00:51:56,730 --> 00:52:00,480 guessable, and you have the ability as a podcaster to expire 913 00:52:00,480 --> 00:52:03,450 feeds or regenerate them or whatever size detect if you 914 00:52:03,450 --> 00:52:06,450 detect some abuse. But the problem again with having those 915 00:52:06,450 --> 00:52:09,600 things exist on Patreon. I don't know how many people are 916 00:52:09,600 --> 00:52:13,230 downloading the Patreon Patreon has zero stats, I don't know if 917 00:52:13,230 --> 00:52:15,870 they're fast or slow downloads, they people don't even know 918 00:52:15,870 --> 00:52:18,810 where to go on Patreon to find the feed that they're supposed 919 00:52:18,810 --> 00:52:22,320 to use this subscribe to. So fireside takes all of this away 920 00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:25,260 and makes it all easy and great with with numbers and stuff like 921 00:52:25,260 --> 00:52:28,410 that. But the problem is, we don't have any kind of like 922 00:52:28,440 --> 00:52:32,280 official partnership with Patreon. And if Patreon decided 923 00:52:32,310 --> 00:52:36,480 today to turn off their API, which they might do, we're 924 00:52:36,480 --> 00:52:40,590 screwed, our customers are using it also get screwed. And they 925 00:52:40,590 --> 00:52:43,980 just announced a partnership with another podcast company 926 00:52:43,980 --> 00:52:47,010 who's doing the same thing, which I suspected and talked 927 00:52:47,010 --> 00:52:51,030 about on a couple shows, because they basically came out with an 928 00:52:51,030 --> 00:52:54,000 announcement back in January saying Yeah, our API is fine. 929 00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:56,310 And we're not going to be updating it anymore. And also, 930 00:52:56,310 --> 00:52:59,490 we're not really going to support it anymore. Which here's 931 00:52:59,490 --> 00:53:00,690 here's our new partnership 932 00:53:00,690 --> 00:53:01,800 over here. Yeah, 933 00:53:01,830 --> 00:53:06,300 exactly. So we implemented it anyway. But the more ways that I 934 00:53:06,300 --> 00:53:12,120 can give customers or podcasters to get get financial support 935 00:53:12,120 --> 00:53:15,060 back to your original question, the more I want to do that, 936 00:53:15,060 --> 00:53:19,500 because I really think that what you guys are on to that's really 937 00:53:19,500 --> 00:53:23,490 the future of podcasting is people saying, I like this, I 938 00:53:23,490 --> 00:53:27,390 want to support it. It's not listening to ads, there will 939 00:53:27,390 --> 00:53:30,480 always be like big shows with big ads. I think that's that's 940 00:53:31,110 --> 00:53:36,180 solidified forever. But I really, if it's me, I love 941 00:53:36,180 --> 00:53:39,900 supporting people and knowing that like they're getting, 942 00:53:39,930 --> 00:53:42,570 you've talked about this so much, Adam, I feel like I can't 943 00:53:42,570 --> 00:53:45,570 add anything to it. But you know, you're supporting the 944 00:53:45,570 --> 00:53:47,730 person directly. And that feels good. Yeah. 945 00:53:48,540 --> 00:53:48,960 Yeah. 946 00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:51,900 You know, the, that's the model. And 947 00:53:53,070 --> 00:53:56,850 over the last few weeks, since I've been using the Sphinx app, 948 00:53:57,150 --> 00:54:00,060 but of course, the the first people that jumped on board, 949 00:54:00,240 --> 00:54:03,210 were all the Bitcoin podcast, guys, right? So they, they go, 950 00:54:03,210 --> 00:54:05,460 they already knew I already understood all this stuff. So 951 00:54:05,460 --> 00:54:08,640 they all jumped in there. So it's mostly that and there's no 952 00:54:08,640 --> 00:54:13,590 agenda in there and podcasting 2.0 so I have been using that to 953 00:54:13,590 --> 00:54:17,490 listen to any of the any of the feeds, I was using overcast. So 954 00:54:17,490 --> 00:54:21,630 any of the feeds that now are lightning enabled, we have 955 00:54:21,750 --> 00:54:24,300 pulled it, remove them from overcast and I'm just listening 956 00:54:24,300 --> 00:54:27,840 to most things I can tell you. One of the things 957 00:54:27,840 --> 00:54:33,420 psychologically is I seriously feel guilty for not paying for a 958 00:54:33,420 --> 00:54:39,300 podcast. I was thinking about that a couple of days ago 959 00:54:39,300 --> 00:54:42,360 because I couldn't. There was a problem with the Sphinx app and 960 00:54:42,360 --> 00:54:45,420 it in it and I ended up having to reinstall it in order to get 961 00:54:45,420 --> 00:54:50,700 it to work. But in the meantime, I wanted to listen to Tales from 962 00:54:50,700 --> 00:54:54,480 the Crypt so I was trying to flip back over to overcast and 963 00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:55,290 it just made like 964 00:54:55,350 --> 00:54:57,060 so bad. Like I felt bad. Yes, 965 00:54:57,239 --> 00:55:00,509 I had like a physical injury feeling in me that I was doing 966 00:55:00,509 --> 00:55:04,769 something wrong by not listening in a way that was going to pay 967 00:55:04,769 --> 00:55:05,489 stay there 968 00:55:05,519 --> 00:55:07,049 powerful Mojo, man. 969 00:55:07,110 --> 00:55:11,790 I like that. It was like, You know what, that's this is a very 970 00:55:11,790 --> 00:55:15,720 interesting concept because this is what's actually, how am I 971 00:55:15,720 --> 00:55:19,350 gonna say this? That's a good thing. Because, you know, we've 972 00:55:19,350 --> 00:55:24,360 talked, we've talked a lot about debt free, the concept of free 973 00:55:24,360 --> 00:55:28,320 needs to die, because there's nothing I want to say this about 974 00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:32,550 fireside as I was looking through, looking on the page I 975 00:55:32,550 --> 00:55:35,880 like is just, here's what you get you pay. This is how much 976 00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:40,110 it's gonna cost you per month. In, there's no free. There's no 977 00:55:40,110 --> 00:55:44,250 free tier where you can have ads and we're gonna try to monetize 978 00:55:44,250 --> 00:55:47,220 you in some right away. It's just straight up price. I 979 00:55:47,220 --> 00:55:51,210 mean, I, I don't like doing that. I don't like that. So why 980 00:55:51,210 --> 00:55:53,880 would I build that into my service? You know, if I don't 981 00:55:53,880 --> 00:55:57,480 like be, and you know that we debated a long time. And I had a 982 00:55:57,480 --> 00:56:00,210 lot of people saying, Oh, you've got to have a free tier, you've 983 00:56:00,210 --> 00:56:03,630 got to have a free tier. And I really have been resistant to 984 00:56:03,630 --> 00:56:06,690 that the way that we're trying to get around that now is we're 985 00:56:06,690 --> 00:56:10,200 and this is hope, Garrett, my developer that works with me 986 00:56:10,200 --> 00:56:13,230 who's been working on this feature, won't get pissed off if 987 00:56:13,230 --> 00:56:15,900 I talk about it, but he's been working really hard on unlike, 988 00:56:16,470 --> 00:56:19,140 basically trials that you don't need a credit card for. So you 989 00:56:19,140 --> 00:56:23,370 can basically just, you know, make a username and password and 990 00:56:23,400 --> 00:56:26,490 you get into you're able to use all the features of fireside 991 00:56:26,490 --> 00:56:30,480 short of like, basically taking the show live everything short 992 00:56:30,480 --> 00:56:33,510 of that you'll be able to use it experiment with it. Because for 993 00:56:33,510 --> 00:56:37,260 whatever reason, even though we've got like a 14 day free 994 00:56:37,260 --> 00:56:41,100 trial, you still got to put a credit card in Yeah. And and 995 00:56:41,100 --> 00:56:44,040 there's a lot you would be shocked at how many p i am 996 00:56:44,040 --> 00:56:47,040 shocked at how many people get to that point and are like, 997 00:56:47,040 --> 00:56:49,980 nope, screw it, I'm out doing it not give I'm not giving them my 998 00:56:49,980 --> 00:56:52,680 credit card. Like we're gonna do something. First of all, like 999 00:56:52,740 --> 00:56:56,520 stripe handles it anyway. But like, what are we like, you 1000 00:56:56,520 --> 00:56:59,520 really are afraid that we're just gonna start charging you if 1001 00:56:59,520 --> 00:57:03,090 you you know, like, if you cancel in the 14 days. Do you 1002 00:57:03,090 --> 00:57:07,380 know how many people over the lifespan? I guess we started in 1003 00:57:07,380 --> 00:57:12,870 two 620 16 the lifespan of fireside how many people have 1004 00:57:12,870 --> 00:57:16,320 gone like past their trial and had to write in and say, Oh, I 1005 00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:21,450 went past my trial and we refund them. Like a dozen, like so few 1006 00:57:21,690 --> 00:57:24,210 people are pretty good about it. I don't know why that's such a 1007 00:57:24,330 --> 00:57:27,090 hang up for people. But fine. If we can make it easier, then, you 1008 00:57:27,090 --> 00:57:28,320 know, we'll let people log in. And 1009 00:57:28,500 --> 00:57:32,970 I will say that when I I wanted to try out buzzsprout and I 1010 00:57:32,970 --> 00:57:36,150 believe they do have exactly that where you can set it all up 1011 00:57:36,150 --> 00:57:41,370 without a credit card. And but you can't publish. And I and it 1012 00:57:41,370 --> 00:57:44,670 took me past the hump like Oh shit, I'll sign up for this. Of 1013 00:57:44,670 --> 00:57:47,010 course they immediately refunded my money and gave me a free 1014 00:57:47,010 --> 00:57:51,870 account. This is silly. But I kind of like that idea. This you 1015 00:57:51,870 --> 00:57:54,510 find that works. You get a percentage of people who try it 1016 00:57:54,510 --> 00:57:57,090 out and then convert is that better for you? Mostly? Yeah, I 1017 00:57:57,090 --> 00:57:59,460 mean, most of it, most of the people who do try it out, do 1018 00:57:59,460 --> 00:58:03,060 wind up you know, using it becoming a customer which is 1019 00:58:03,060 --> 00:58:08,100 great. But you know, it's it's like any kind of barrier that I 1020 00:58:08,100 --> 00:58:12,570 can help remove for people to get to get in not just into 1021 00:58:12,570 --> 00:58:16,110 fireside but into podcasting in general. Because, gosh, compare 1022 00:58:16,110 --> 00:58:20,760 where we are now in in 20 with where we were five years ago 1023 00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:24,330 like it is a completely different universe. And it's so 1024 00:58:24,390 --> 00:58:27,900 easy to get started. Now you can buy like this microphone that 1025 00:58:27,900 --> 00:58:30,600 I'm using my little home microphone it's you know, what 1026 00:58:30,600 --> 00:58:33,660 is it 100 bucks or something like that's that's not a huge 1027 00:58:33,660 --> 00:58:36,960 investment in how much Didn't you know did the guy who likes 1028 00:58:36,960 --> 00:58:40,470 to go fly fishing, invest in his fly fishing hobby, hundreds, if 1029 00:58:40,470 --> 00:58:44,190 not thousands of dollars to get all the right equipment and the 1030 00:58:44,190 --> 00:58:46,620 gear and learning how to cast the line and learning it. You 1031 00:58:46,620 --> 00:58:49,410 know, like that's an expensive hobby that I just picked. But 1032 00:58:49,410 --> 00:58:52,590 even a bowling ball of people even go bowling anymore. a 1033 00:58:52,590 --> 00:58:55,170 bowling ball cost more than that. And shoes cost more than 1034 00:58:55,170 --> 00:58:59,310 that. So now with podcasting, it's so easy to get interested 1035 00:58:59,310 --> 00:59:01,950 in it, it should be easy for people to do it. But back to 1036 00:59:01,950 --> 00:59:06,960 your comment about free. I just don't believe free. Makes sense. 1037 00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:09,600 There's always a catch. There's always a catch. 1038 00:59:09,660 --> 00:59:14,040 Well, free is expensive at the end of the day, I had. So web 1039 00:59:14,040 --> 00:59:20,310 3.0 which I have a feeling will run on some form of blockchain 1040 00:59:20,310 --> 00:59:23,460 type infrastructure may be quicker than we then we realize 1041 00:59:23,610 --> 00:59:25,920 I had a pretty good experience today I was trying to find some 1042 00:59:25,920 --> 00:59:30,930 documentation on a specific lightning node function. And I 1043 00:59:30,930 --> 00:59:34,860 came across the site, which is really nice, really well laid 1044 00:59:34,860 --> 00:59:38,430 out, you know, it's like someone took the GitHub Pages and then 1045 00:59:38,430 --> 00:59:42,750 made the documentation easy to understand color coded it and I 1046 00:59:42,750 --> 00:59:45,750 was like, Oh, this is exactly the info I wanted. And it said, 1047 00:59:46,200 --> 00:59:52,200 pay 150 satoshis or no is it three cents to continue? And I'm 1048 00:59:52,200 --> 00:59:56,700 like, Oh, hold on a second. You click on the button up pops a QR 1049 00:59:56,700 --> 00:59:59,970 code. I scan it with my phone. I hit yes. Boom, that page loads 1050 01:00:00,900 --> 01:00:03,990 That was a good experience. And I felt pretty good as well. 1051 01:00:03,990 --> 01:00:06,930 Because I saw most of the page I needed the information I didn't 1052 01:00:06,930 --> 01:00:10,620 have yet I knew it was obfuscated by this paywall, but 1053 01:00:10,620 --> 01:00:15,090 it was so fast and so easy for me to just, you know, pick a 1054 01:00:15,090 --> 01:00:19,380 random wallet scan the QR code done, very enjoyable. 1055 01:00:20,310 --> 01:00:23,520 They will process is difficult to get to overcome just in and 1056 01:00:23,520 --> 01:00:27,630 of itself, it's really not about it's not so much about paying as 1057 01:00:27,630 --> 01:00:32,670 it is. Is it is like this conjunction between two you're 1058 01:00:32,670 --> 01:00:37,560 paying and and how the process is going to work. Because when 1059 01:00:37,650 --> 01:00:41,400 if I'm if I'm clicking over to Vanity Fair, and to read an 1060 01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:44,850 article and it pops up a paywall, like, you know, I mean, 1061 01:00:44,880 --> 01:00:47,430 yeah, he's like, his shit, right? 1062 01:00:47,700 --> 01:00:53,400 Yeah, I mean, like, but but if I click over to sub substack, or 1063 01:00:53,400 --> 01:00:55,950 somebody there who I know is like an independent person who's 1064 01:00:55,950 --> 01:01:00,240 going to charge me five bucks a month, it's theirs, I'm willing 1065 01:01:00,240 --> 01:01:03,630 to sort of jump over the jump over the fence there and go 1066 01:01:03,630 --> 01:01:05,910 through the process of doing a stripe payment and all that kind 1067 01:01:05,910 --> 01:01:08,310 of thing. But doesn't like, well, this guy's gonna get all 1068 01:01:08,310 --> 01:01:11,520 the money, and he's gonna get most of this. And he's gonna get 1069 01:01:11,520 --> 01:01:13,830 a lion's share. I wonder 1070 01:01:13,830 --> 01:01:16,830 what stack fees are? I don't actually know what they're 1071 01:01:16,830 --> 01:01:20,490 charging should look into that. Yeah, I'm sure they're doing 1072 01:01:20,490 --> 01:01:21,510 Patreon level. 1073 01:01:22,440 --> 01:01:25,320 Yeah, I'm sure. I'm sure it's got to be small. Because 1074 01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:27,480 otherwise you couldn't really make a five bucks a month thing 1075 01:01:27,480 --> 01:01:29,190 work? Yeah, but 1076 01:01:29,190 --> 01:01:31,170 if they take 10% 1077 01:01:32,280 --> 01:01:35,670 mastery. Yeah, I don't know what the I don't know what that is, 1078 01:01:35,670 --> 01:01:39,270 is there's just some sort of some sort of conjunction between 1079 01:01:39,270 --> 01:01:42,810 who it is and, and the process that is going to 1080 01:01:42,810 --> 01:01:47,160 take, right. Yeah, I agree. And, and you feel when you're even if 1081 01:01:47,160 --> 01:01:49,320 you have your credit card details pre loaded in your 1082 01:01:49,320 --> 01:01:53,760 browser, auto fill, whatever. It's still. And by the way, if 1083 01:01:53,760 --> 01:01:56,370 I'm doing that for three cents, I'm not doing it and nor is the 1084 01:01:56,370 --> 01:01:59,370 credit card company, they're not. Either they're like, No, 1085 01:01:59,520 --> 01:02:02,280 no, you got to have at least $1 or whatever. I'm sure there's 1086 01:02:02,280 --> 01:02:05,550 some some limit because the feature just down the line or 1087 01:02:05,550 --> 01:02:08,910 higher for them. I just think that ease once you make it that 1088 01:02:08,910 --> 01:02:13,260 easy, and I know guaranteed three cents is going to go from 1089 01:02:13,260 --> 01:02:15,840 me to somewhere I don't give a crap. I know the guy's gonna get 1090 01:02:15,840 --> 01:02:18,000 it, he's going to get it directly. It's not going to get 1091 01:02:18,000 --> 01:02:20,370 subverted somewhere else. And it was easy 1092 01:02:20,550 --> 01:02:22,410 to set up an account and get 1093 01:02:22,860 --> 01:02:24,420 an account. Yeah, exactly. 1094 01:02:24,810 --> 01:02:28,320 Well, what Dan, or your you mentioned dynamic Anis, are 1095 01:02:28,320 --> 01:02:30,660 y'all doing any sort of ad insertion tech? 1096 01:02:31,020 --> 01:02:35,490 I mean that we're working on that hard. Just not be I 1097 01:02:35,490 --> 01:02:39,450 personally, I don't like dynamic ad insertion. And there's 1098 01:02:39,480 --> 01:02:42,900 there's two different when people say dynamic ad insertion, 1099 01:02:43,410 --> 01:02:46,470 there's kind of two different takes on it. One kind of 1100 01:02:46,470 --> 01:02:50,250 building on the second one. The first one is, I have a podcast, 1101 01:02:50,280 --> 01:02:53,640 there are certain areas of the podcast time codes of the 1102 01:02:53,640 --> 01:02:57,120 podcast that I've designated as Oh, my god, yes. Ready for an 1103 01:02:57,120 --> 01:03:00,780 ad? Yeah, right. And that will tell me what you're thinking I'm 1104 01:03:00,780 --> 01:03:01,050 because I'm 1105 01:03:01,170 --> 01:03:03,840 not I don't want to interrupt, keep going. Sorry about the 1106 01:03:03,840 --> 01:03:04,800 timecode problem. 1107 01:03:04,980 --> 01:03:09,600 Okay, so then, so then you insert your ad into that 1108 01:03:09,600 --> 01:03:12,450 programmatically. So you might you might say, well, I've got my 1109 01:03:12,450 --> 01:03:14,970 back catalogue, I've got 100 episodes, and I want to sell 1110 01:03:14,970 --> 01:03:18,450 them for 1000 bucks a month. And, you know, some mattress 1111 01:03:18,450 --> 01:03:21,510 company wants to pay me to put their ads. So I'll go do the ad 1112 01:03:21,510 --> 01:03:23,610 read for the mattress company and talk about how awesome the 1113 01:03:23,610 --> 01:03:27,420 mattress is. And then it's the system will use these time codes 1114 01:03:27,420 --> 01:03:31,440 that I've already entered in and drop this ad into the pre 1115 01:03:31,440 --> 01:03:35,310 existing back catalogue of shows, or maybe even in the new 1116 01:03:35,310 --> 01:03:37,710 app set of episodes that are coming out, it'll automatically 1117 01:03:37,710 --> 01:03:42,750 put them in, and and then now i can i can monetize that. And 1118 01:03:42,750 --> 01:03:45,930 then next month, I'm going to get 1000 bucks from some other 1119 01:03:45,930 --> 01:03:49,290 company and, um, it's going to go back and replace that in all 1120 01:03:49,290 --> 01:03:52,920 of those. All of those episodes, again, it's going to take the 1121 01:03:52,920 --> 01:03:55,950 mattress that out and put in the ad for the web hosting company. 1122 01:03:55,980 --> 01:04:00,750 And, and and, and then there's also the concept of dynamic ad 1123 01:04:00,750 --> 01:04:04,350 insertion, where it goes a step further than that and actually 1124 01:04:04,350 --> 01:04:08,280 serves different ads to different people based on their 1125 01:04:08,280 --> 01:04:11,910 geographic or geolocation. Right. So that they so that the 1126 01:04:11,910 --> 01:04:15,870 person who's in, you know, Alabama is going to hear an ad 1127 01:04:15,870 --> 01:04:20,370 for, you know, for their local company or some kind of regional 1128 01:04:20,370 --> 01:04:21,510 promotion. Go ahead, 1129 01:04:21,630 --> 01:04:24,390 pickup trucks, you can say yeah, hey, now we know where Dave's 1130 01:04:24,390 --> 01:04:26,040 from a dance, you 1131 01:04:26,040 --> 01:04:27,690 know, in Austin. Okay. 1132 01:04:28,650 --> 01:04:31,860 We got beamers we got ads for beamers and oskaloosa. Tesla's 1133 01:04:32,940 --> 01:04:33,900 Tesla, Yes, 1134 01:04:33,900 --> 01:04:34,680 exactly. 1135 01:04:35,400 --> 01:04:37,800 And then you know, the person in California is gonna get an ad 1136 01:04:37,800 --> 01:04:41,130 for a Prius. So basically, that's the that's the concept 1137 01:04:41,130 --> 01:04:44,280 and, and we're not doing the second one. At this point, we're 1138 01:04:44,280 --> 01:04:48,870 looking at doing the first one, which would make it easy for 1139 01:04:48,870 --> 01:04:54,060 people to put an ad into their pre existing or new episode. 1140 01:04:54,240 --> 01:04:57,360 They put in a time code that says here's where the ads should 1141 01:04:57,360 --> 01:05:03,210 go. And then our software adds it. But though, I've seen so 1142 01:05:03,210 --> 01:05:07,800 many different implementations of this, and my take on dynamic 1143 01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:13,260 ads are just, you know, I have, unlike unlike Adam, um, we have 1144 01:05:13,260 --> 01:05:17,760 done lots and lots of ads over the years in my shows. And, you 1145 01:05:17,760 --> 01:05:21,810 know, I always look at no agenda, and I'm like, I should 1146 01:05:21,810 --> 01:05:22,920 have done it that way. I should. 1147 01:05:23,430 --> 01:05:24,540 Not too late man. 1148 01:05:24,899 --> 01:05:28,379 No, and it's not too late. Unless, like you depend on the 1149 01:05:28,379 --> 01:05:31,889 ads that you have for the, you know, the income that you need, 1150 01:05:31,949 --> 01:05:35,069 I would love to do stuff. That's, that's just fully 1151 01:05:35,069 --> 01:05:37,799 listener supported. And most of the stuff that I'm doing now, 1152 01:05:37,979 --> 01:05:40,799 any new stuff that I work on, I'm trying to make listener 1153 01:05:40,799 --> 01:05:47,249 supported, because it's better. But you know, there. It's just 1154 01:05:47,249 --> 01:05:52,919 it's frustrating, because only bigger shows can get ads. And so 1155 01:05:52,919 --> 01:05:55,949 you have people who don't have a lot of downloads, and I've heard 1156 01:05:55,949 --> 01:05:58,739 this argument made by a lot of fireside customers for why they 1157 01:05:58,739 --> 01:06:01,709 want it. I've told them, like, you know, dynamically inserted 1158 01:06:01,709 --> 01:06:05,099 ads, they don't really work. They don't really perform that 1159 01:06:05,099 --> 01:06:08,549 well. And in my opinion, in many cases, they detract from the 1160 01:06:08,549 --> 01:06:11,579 quality of the show, they interrupt the show, it sounds 1161 01:06:11,579 --> 01:06:14,759 different. It doesn't sound genuine, even if it's host read. 1162 01:06:14,969 --> 01:06:18,869 And it they don't from what we've always heard from all of 1163 01:06:18,869 --> 01:06:22,079 the sponsors that I've worked with, for, you know, since since 1164 01:06:22,079 --> 01:06:28,079 2006, is that they don't work well, either. And they cheat. I 1165 01:06:28,079 --> 01:06:31,859 believe they cheapen the podcasts. And so the people who, 1166 01:06:31,919 --> 01:06:34,889 who let me just finish this point, the PA system that they 1167 01:06:34,889 --> 01:06:40,649 want them have said, Oh, well, I might make $25 a month doing 1168 01:06:40,649 --> 01:06:43,349 this. And I said yeah, but like you're screwing up your podcasts 1169 01:06:43,349 --> 01:06:46,109 like right, but that's 25 bucks a month. I could save up and get 1170 01:06:46,109 --> 01:06:48,719 a new microphone or something. Well, I guess that's a that's a 1171 01:06:48,719 --> 01:06:52,079 point. Right? But why bro? I don't love that. 1172 01:06:52,590 --> 01:06:58,320 I brought clips. So Adam play. If you want to hear if you want 1173 01:06:58,320 --> 01:07:03,030 to hear some dynamic adduser Yeah. Like clip one. This is 1174 01:07:03,030 --> 01:07:06,900 from this is from a Spotify original. What is the name of 1175 01:07:06,900 --> 01:07:07,830 this show? Let's see 1176 01:07:07,830 --> 01:07:08,970 mama knows best. 1177 01:07:09,150 --> 01:07:11,250 Mama knows best. That's it. Thank 1178 01:07:11,250 --> 01:07:14,490 you guys for all the support with the podcast. And I'm super 1179 01:07:14,490 --> 01:07:18,480 excited to see how you guys like the new updates. So I love you 1180 01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:20,790 all so much. And let's get into it. 1181 01:07:21,510 --> 01:07:25,950 Okay, stop. Stop it. You're about to hear this. This is this 1182 01:07:25,950 --> 01:07:32,160 is a Spotify exclusive. So this Spotify has got the full stack, 1183 01:07:32,220 --> 01:07:37,080 right? You know, MIT, humongous mega company. There. They can 1184 01:07:37,410 --> 01:07:41,790 they can laser focus, their dynamic ad insertion. 1185 01:07:43,980 --> 01:07:46,170 With surgical precision, surgical 1186 01:07:46,680 --> 01:07:49,380 precision. Yes, surgical precision. Alright, go. 1187 01:07:49,530 --> 01:07:50,700 And let's get into it. 1188 01:07:54,930 --> 01:07:57,180 So, before this episode, 1189 01:07:58,380 --> 01:08:02,280 how do you spend it? Okay, so he cuts her off in the in the 1190 01:08:02,280 --> 01:08:03,990 middle of a word. It's like, 1191 01:08:04,020 --> 01:08:07,920 so boom. Ad came? Two seconds too late. 1192 01:08:08,280 --> 01:08:13,470 Yeah, I mean, if if Spotify is that is their whole deal. And I 1193 01:08:13,470 --> 01:08:17,400 mean, is is top to bottom, we get the full stack man, laser 1194 01:08:17,400 --> 01:08:21,750 precision surgical. We can stick. It's horrible. Horrible. 1195 01:08:21,780 --> 01:08:24,480 And it cuts it off mid word. I mean, if they can't even do it, 1196 01:08:24,480 --> 01:08:27,420 right. Well, I mean, what I mean, it's just not, it's not 1197 01:08:27,420 --> 01:08:27,990 doable. 1198 01:08:28,920 --> 01:08:32,040 That's, you know, you wonder you wonder is that because the host 1199 01:08:32,040 --> 01:08:35,610 of the show or the producer of the show? Put the timecode in 1200 01:08:35,640 --> 01:08:38,910 wrong by a second or half second, or because the person 1201 01:08:38,910 --> 01:08:42,060 recording it didn't leave enough of a gap. And the other thing 1202 01:08:42,060 --> 01:08:45,360 is, what if you don't have any spot at all? How do you intro 1203 01:08:45,360 --> 01:08:48,180 it? Do you say oh, we want to thank our sponsor, how sad and 1204 01:08:48,180 --> 01:08:51,300 then you're back, like, you know, like, it's, there's so 1205 01:08:51,300 --> 01:08:54,330 much that has not been really explored. 1206 01:08:54,660 --> 01:09:04,020 We had pod show we were doing this 12 years ago. We were I 1207 01:09:04,020 --> 01:09:08,700 know we experimented with ad insertion. But the thing that 1208 01:09:08,700 --> 01:09:12,990 was the most exciting, which I'm gonna give Spotify, a free idea. 1209 01:09:13,680 --> 01:09:16,710 We had the golden ticket blatantly stolen from Willy 1210 01:09:16,710 --> 01:09:20,880 Wonka. And we had, I don't know, 20 different shows. And they 1211 01:09:20,880 --> 01:09:23,790 were promoting that if you listen to their show, you had a 1212 01:09:23,790 --> 01:09:26,970 chance of getting the golden ticket. And so we had, I think 1213 01:09:26,970 --> 01:09:31,680 10 or 15 golden tickets for some prize. And we would literally 1214 01:09:31,980 --> 01:09:37,530 insert that into just one or two in those 15 individually served 1215 01:09:37,560 --> 01:09:41,220 mp3 is across these different shows that some random generator 1216 01:09:41,220 --> 01:09:44,280 would come up with. And someone would hear you won the Golden 1217 01:09:44,280 --> 01:09:47,550 Ticket right in the middle of kind of show. More or less the 1218 01:09:47,550 --> 01:09:50,550 spot Well, this was all post produced. So we knew exactly 1219 01:09:50,550 --> 01:09:53,760 where to put the timecode in. But it was you know, for like 1220 01:09:53,760 --> 01:09:58,620 one individual person. It was very cool at the time and but 1221 01:09:58,620 --> 01:10:02,160 that was kind of for a gaming A fun element. And now it's just 1222 01:10:02,160 --> 01:10:07,020 become a, it's almost as bad as early cable television into 1223 01:10:07,020 --> 01:10:09,180 still happens today, you know, when you're when your local 1224 01:10:09,180 --> 01:10:12,510 cable station cuts to a break, but there's something messes up 1225 01:10:12,510 --> 01:10:15,150 with the timecode. And you see part of the national spot and it 1226 01:10:15,150 --> 01:10:18,090 cuts that off and it comes back and you get your car dealership. 1227 01:10:18,420 --> 01:10:21,450 And these things. No one's really ever perfected it. 1228 01:10:23,070 --> 01:10:26,310 Yeah, it's all of this is very tough and very confusing. And, 1229 01:10:26,550 --> 01:10:30,240 you know, the funny thing is that for so long, everyone said, 1230 01:10:30,240 --> 01:10:33,750 Wow, podcasting, it's so much better than radio. And one of 1231 01:10:33,750 --> 01:10:36,330 the big reasons that they always said it was better than radio is 1232 01:10:36,330 --> 01:10:39,870 because it didn't have stupid intrusive ads. And guess what 1233 01:10:39,870 --> 01:10:40,770 we're getting? 1234 01:10:41,370 --> 01:10:43,890 Well, Dan, I can't tell you how to run your business. And I 1235 01:10:43,890 --> 01:10:48,210 never would. But it seems to me if you added a value block 1236 01:10:48,210 --> 01:10:53,070 feature and sold, sold little mini nodes to your customers for 1237 01:10:53,070 --> 01:10:57,750 a couple extra bucks a month. They could probably coerce their 1238 01:10:57,750 --> 01:11:02,370 own audiences into into pledging money to listen and they would 1239 01:11:02,640 --> 01:11:06,570 have would get to that $25 a month pretty quickly. I think 1240 01:11:06,570 --> 01:11:09,510 you're right. Now I need you don't really have to learn how 1241 01:11:09,510 --> 01:11:17,580 to pitch other than pay pledge. You know, just and and do it for 1242 01:11:17,580 --> 01:11:18,960 all the podcasts you like, 1243 01:11:20,130 --> 01:11:24,060 trying to decide which is worse, a dynamic ad insertion or a host 1244 01:11:24,060 --> 01:11:28,050 read that is just like, so obvious that the person has it 1245 01:11:28,260 --> 01:11:31,860 as no idea what their what their pitch. And those are, those are 1246 01:11:31,860 --> 01:11:34,890 sometimes painful to listen well, so bad 1247 01:11:34,920 --> 01:11:37,680 as long as you can fast forward and you get that outside of 1248 01:11:37,680 --> 01:11:40,590 Spotify and Spotify. So if you can't fast forward through the 1249 01:11:40,590 --> 01:11:44,610 ads. So I love Megan Kelly's podcast. I think she's a pro 1250 01:11:44,610 --> 01:11:49,020 podcaster You know, it helps if you're rich. Because you know, 1251 01:11:49,020 --> 01:11:53,580 podcasting is a vow of poverty. But when she goes into a host 1252 01:11:53,580 --> 01:11:59,250 read, I'm like, fast forward. Like it's so demeaning to her 1253 01:11:59,250 --> 01:12:03,630 even like you shouldn't be reading this Megan, this icky. I 1254 01:12:03,630 --> 01:12:04,140 don't like it. 1255 01:12:05,310 --> 01:12:10,830 What, what it what podcasts are you currently excited about are 1256 01:12:10,830 --> 01:12:13,530 doing, Dan because I know you've always seemed to have, you know, 1257 01:12:13,560 --> 01:12:17,250 a dozen irons in the fire. I remember. I think the podcast 1258 01:12:17,250 --> 01:12:20,340 that I listened to, I think the first podcast I ever heard with 1259 01:12:20,340 --> 01:12:25,410 you and it was back to work now. And okay, so I'll give you the 1260 01:12:25,680 --> 01:12:30,120 the back to work podcast is the podcast that made me stop 1261 01:12:30,120 --> 01:12:36,900 listening to podcasts at one and a half speed dial. Yeah, I was 1262 01:12:36,900 --> 01:12:40,530 like, I would always set it to one and one and a half speed 1263 01:12:40,680 --> 01:12:45,660 with this with shortened silences and listening in if you 1264 01:12:45,660 --> 01:12:50,190 start listening to Merlin man, no, with that, it's like luck. 1265 01:12:50,370 --> 01:12:54,270 Yeah, I mean, it's like, you know, he's like you're on crack 1266 01:12:54,270 --> 01:12:57,570 or something. I mean, it's like the you know, yeah, no, no, I 1267 01:12:57,570 --> 01:13:00,750 can't do this. That got me out of that habit. But what are you 1268 01:13:00,780 --> 01:13:03,930 what what podcasts are you into right now? 1269 01:13:04,110 --> 01:13:09,150 Well, the references that Merlin drops require Oh, you know like 1270 01:13:09,180 --> 01:13:13,020 he's so fast and I don't understand how anyone could 1271 01:13:13,020 --> 01:13:16,020 listen to that at anything but one time speed and then you 1272 01:13:16,020 --> 01:13:19,320 always get the people commenting like I heard you guys talking on 1273 01:13:19,320 --> 01:13:23,490 one one time speed and you both sound like you're drunk. I'm 1274 01:13:23,610 --> 01:13:26,580 really what is the rest of the world sound like to you? How do 1275 01:13:26,580 --> 01:13:30,540 you function in the real world when with people talking at one 1276 01:13:30,540 --> 01:13:32,940 speed like it must be really painful for you. 1277 01:13:33,300 --> 01:13:37,200 I think your brain up I think you can't like after a while I 1278 01:13:37,200 --> 01:13:40,920 would notice that when I got home from work on a on a commute 1279 01:13:40,920 --> 01:13:43,620 and I started to get out of the car when is to start talking to 1280 01:13:43,620 --> 01:13:47,130 my wife. I'm like this. Something doesn't feel right. 1281 01:13:47,190 --> 01:13:49,080 Yeah, you're like Hurry up, honey, hurry up, get to the 1282 01:13:49,080 --> 01:13:51,330 point. What do you want to say? What's going on here? Come on, 1283 01:13:51,330 --> 01:13:51,480 come 1284 01:13:51,480 --> 01:13:54,390 on. Come on. It's like you're it's like you've lived in an 1285 01:13:54,390 --> 01:13:57,630 episode of Gilmore Girls for the last hour and a half. And now 1286 01:13:57,630 --> 01:14:00,360 you and now nobody told no, there's the witty banter. 1287 01:14:01,980 --> 01:14:03,900 exactly what it is. Yes. 1288 01:14:03,900 --> 01:14:04,830 Right. Right. 1289 01:14:04,950 --> 01:14:09,480 Well, I have a very clear stance on this fast listening I I 1290 01:14:09,480 --> 01:14:13,980 believe I deliver a piece of art with every show and I question 1291 01:14:13,980 --> 01:14:19,350 if you jog past the Mona Lisa dammit. I think you should be 1292 01:14:19,350 --> 01:14:22,620 listening to my art and regular speed the way I intended it. 1293 01:14:23,820 --> 01:14:26,280 I don't know why people are in such a hurry that you know the 1294 01:14:26,310 --> 01:14:29,490 the response that I got when I used to really chastise people 1295 01:14:29,490 --> 01:14:32,850 about this eventually just gave up but I used to get like all 1296 01:14:32,850 --> 01:14:36,510 bent out of shape about it was you know, people said, Well, if 1297 01:14:36,510 --> 01:14:39,630 I can't listen it two times, then I won't be listening at all 1298 01:14:39,630 --> 01:14:42,540 because I don't have enough time in the day. I'm like, really, 1299 01:14:42,630 --> 01:14:45,360 really? Like do you fast forward? Do you watch your shows 1300 01:14:45,360 --> 01:14:48,570 on fast forward? That will if I could I would? Yeah. Well, I 1301 01:14:48,570 --> 01:14:51,660 agree with Dave on this. I think it messes people's brains up. 1302 01:14:51,660 --> 01:14:54,420 They get antsy. It probably goes well with the Adderall 1303 01:14:54,420 --> 01:15:01,380 generation. But I think it's it it may have Some longer term 1304 01:15:01,380 --> 01:15:06,510 cognitive effects on how you how you vary posture for things. I 1305 01:15:06,510 --> 01:15:09,300 don't know. I mean, you know, if you they say if you put on 1306 01:15:09,300 --> 01:15:12,300 glasses that invert everything within a day or two, you see a 1307 01:15:12,300 --> 01:15:13,440 normal. Yeah, 1308 01:15:13,440 --> 01:15:15,450 I don't understand that. I've heard the same thing. And it 1309 01:15:15,450 --> 01:15:16,740 freaks me out a little bit. I'm 1310 01:15:16,740 --> 01:15:17,670 wearing it right now. 1311 01:15:21,300 --> 01:15:23,340 So Dave, you're asking what shows I do or what what I 1312 01:15:23,340 --> 01:15:23,970 listened to? 1313 01:15:24,329 --> 01:15:27,119 Now, what do you do? Which shows are you excited about doing 1314 01:15:27,119 --> 01:15:27,449 right now? 1315 01:15:27,510 --> 01:15:30,540 So the ones that I've been I've been doing back to work you 1316 01:15:30,540 --> 01:15:39,540 mentioned with Merlin man since January of 2011, I think. Yeah. 1317 01:15:39,540 --> 01:15:42,360 And we're, we're, we're still having fun with it. I still love 1318 01:15:42,360 --> 01:15:45,330 talking to Merlin every week. And, and so I'm, I'm always 1319 01:15:45,330 --> 01:15:48,120 still happy to do that one. I do a show with john Roderick, like 1320 01:15:48,120 --> 01:15:51,510 I mentioned before, called roadwork, which we started doing 1321 01:15:51,510 --> 01:15:55,380 off the top of my head, I'm gonna say back in maybe august 1322 01:15:55,620 --> 01:16:01,080 of 25th 18. I think sounds right. So we've been doing that 1323 01:16:01,080 --> 01:16:05,760 show for a long time. I do a show called quit, where I help 1324 01:16:05,760 --> 01:16:10,050 people who write in or sometimes call in, they figure out what 1325 01:16:10,050 --> 01:16:12,420 they're doing with their mainly their business, their career, 1326 01:16:12,420 --> 01:16:14,670 that kind of thing. And that's a show that I've always had a lot 1327 01:16:14,670 --> 01:16:18,000 of fun with. And, and I love the letters that I get and the 1328 01:16:18,030 --> 01:16:22,290 questions that people ask. It's just it's so much fun. And then 1329 01:16:22,320 --> 01:16:25,800 there's, there's two other shows that I'm coming out with. One of 1330 01:16:25,800 --> 01:16:30,120 them is there is sort of a running joke on a couple my 1331 01:16:30,120 --> 01:16:33,720 other shows that we would always get feedback from people saying 1332 01:16:33,930 --> 01:16:38,400 how they listen to us or me and it puts them to sleep. They 1333 01:16:38,400 --> 01:16:40,800 listen at night when they're falling asleep. And I said well, 1334 01:16:41,190 --> 01:16:44,970 then I'll just do a show designed to do that. So go, I'm 1335 01:16:45,000 --> 01:16:48,750 I'm doing I'm going into the because you've got to use public 1336 01:16:48,750 --> 01:16:51,690 domain books. So I'm going to be reading public domain books like 1337 01:16:51,690 --> 01:16:54,990 the first one then I let people vote I let people vote. They 1338 01:16:54,990 --> 01:16:58,260 picked were the world's Ah, so I'm gonna be I'm gonna be 1339 01:16:58,260 --> 01:17:01,200 reading more of the world's two people to help them chill out. 1340 01:17:01,200 --> 01:17:04,830 And so that shows called the evening read. And and then after 1341 01:17:04,920 --> 01:17:06,870 afterward the world's they'll pick the next book, and I'll 1342 01:17:06,870 --> 01:17:09,450 just read them and they can listen to them and enjoy them. 1343 01:17:09,450 --> 01:17:09,990 See, that is 1344 01:17:10,500 --> 01:17:11,520 a great idea. 1345 01:17:11,580 --> 01:17:15,450 That's the perfect idea for the value blog, because they sleep 1346 01:17:15,450 --> 01:17:16,650 and it stays running. 1347 01:17:19,530 --> 01:17:22,800 Literally while they sleep instead of why sleep. It's 1348 01:17:22,800 --> 01:17:27,630 genius. And, and then the other show is a show that I've been 1349 01:17:27,630 --> 01:17:34,350 wanting to do for a very, very, very long time. That that is, 1350 01:17:34,530 --> 01:17:38,280 you know, very, I just want to do it the right way. So I've 1351 01:17:38,280 --> 01:17:41,280 been really procrastinating and I'm no I'm overthinking it now, 1352 01:17:41,280 --> 01:17:44,670 but I want to do a show where I add them where I explore a 1353 01:17:44,670 --> 01:17:51,030 different kinds of alternate reality kind of things, whether 1354 01:17:51,030 --> 01:17:57,210 it's UFOs, or alien abduction or simulation theory, or as always 1355 01:17:57,210 --> 01:17:57,600 trying to 1356 01:17:58,230 --> 01:18:01,410 do another show with him. Yeah, he's trying to suck me in once 1357 01:18:01,410 --> 01:18:04,620 again. No, Dan, you lost your shot, man. You lost it. I 1358 01:18:04,620 --> 01:18:07,650 did. I know. This was this was 10 years ago. 1359 01:18:08,640 --> 01:18:11,340 Now you didn't lose anything. My brother didn't lose anything. 1360 01:18:11,760 --> 01:18:14,610 Oh, prove me wrong, then come to the show with me. 1361 01:18:14,670 --> 01:18:17,070 No. You know, right now you 1362 01:18:17,070 --> 01:18:20,400 started like 20 different shows. Since then. I've been talking 1363 01:18:20,400 --> 01:18:23,130 about I feel left out over here and we're in Austin together. 1364 01:18:23,130 --> 01:18:24,300 We're Austin brothers. 1365 01:18:24,330 --> 01:18:28,740 No, I got I'm producing five shows a week now. This is this 1366 01:18:28,740 --> 01:18:28,920 is 1367 01:18:28,950 --> 01:18:31,410 how much worse would be to do one more. 1368 01:18:33,150 --> 01:18:34,950 much difference between five and six. I thought 1369 01:18:35,580 --> 01:18:37,920 five was the max that's what I always learned. 1370 01:18:39,750 --> 01:18:43,260 Alright, but I only listen Dave I only listen to one podcast 1371 01:18:43,260 --> 01:18:46,710 well to now. No agenda and then this show. Yeah. No. 1372 01:18:48,030 --> 01:18:50,400 Shit. Nice. 1373 01:18:50,580 --> 01:18:55,050 No, what I love about podcasting 2.0 since it never got what got 1374 01:18:55,050 --> 01:19:00,630 rejected for image reasons. At the apple index, I never re 1375 01:19:00,630 --> 01:19:04,410 submitted it to now whenever I'm trying a podcast I know real 1376 01:19:04,410 --> 01:19:08,370 quick if they're tied into podcasts index.org or not. Okay, 1377 01:19:08,430 --> 01:19:09,780 you don't you're not tied in 1378 01:19:10,890 --> 01:19:12,180 my secret weapon site. 1379 01:19:12,270 --> 01:19:14,880 Wait, you're saying Apple Apple rejected the show. 1380 01:19:15,480 --> 01:19:19,620 It was the artwork was something wrong size or God knows what it 1381 01:19:19,620 --> 01:19:20,100 was? And 1382 01:19:20,369 --> 01:19:23,819 they want I think they want 3000 by 3000 pixel. Yeah, 1383 01:19:23,820 --> 01:19:27,840 I think I think I gave him 2000 by 2000. And then he got 1384 01:19:27,840 --> 01:19:31,170 rejected. And I was like, you know, yeah, I'm just gonna leave 1385 01:19:31,170 --> 01:19:33,300 it. Let's just let's just not registered, and it's become a 1386 01:19:33,300 --> 01:19:36,390 really handy tool. Now it's like, let me see, because these 1387 01:19:36,390 --> 01:19:39,090 guys say they're not they're not integrated with our index. Hold 1388 01:19:39,090 --> 01:19:41,850 on a second. Otherwise, you'd find this show could 1389 01:19:42,119 --> 01:19:45,419 like that. That's a good topic because we eat it. You know, 1390 01:19:45,419 --> 01:19:50,819 part of the idea of starting the index was living outside the 1391 01:19:50,819 --> 01:19:57,269 apple ecosystem so that we have an independent index of podcasts 1392 01:19:57,269 --> 01:20:00,959 that don't require Apple to be the sort of thing The universe 1393 01:20:01,409 --> 01:20:07,109 and because it just not it doesn't make sense for us it 1394 01:20:07,109 --> 01:20:11,219 makes sense for one for a large many basically the largest 1395 01:20:11,369 --> 01:20:15,689 corporate entity in the world to be also the default Yellow Pages 1396 01:20:15,689 --> 01:20:20,069 for what is supposed to be an open an open standards 1397 01:20:20,069 --> 01:20:24,779 ecosystem. Right and so we we do a lot of things if you look at 1398 01:20:24,779 --> 01:20:28,889 our you know how much total how many total feeds we have it's 1399 01:20:28,889 --> 01:20:33,299 lower than some other you know, we've we've got roughly 1.3 1400 01:20:33,299 --> 01:20:36,269 something million feeds and others it's like three 1401 01:20:36,300 --> 01:20:40,140 hours old guys like what do you expect? Like you know what I'm 1402 01:20:40,140 --> 01:20:43,710 saying like a barely launched this thing. It's just give it 1403 01:20:43,710 --> 01:20:47,850 time. We have crazy how many you've got in the time that 1404 01:20:47,850 --> 01:20:51,270 you've been out? It's crazy. How many you've got? Well, I 1405 01:20:51,270 --> 01:20:54,990 appreciate fires, appreciate you. Because, like me, y'all 1406 01:20:54,990 --> 01:20:58,260 started auto submitting your new fates to us. I mean, God early. 1407 01:20:58,650 --> 01:21:02,970 Well, I was like, within a week of when we quote unquote, 1408 01:21:02,970 --> 01:21:05,160 launched it was the squishy isn't. It was 1409 01:21:05,400 --> 01:21:08,340 wasn't a launch is more like we leaked under the door. 1410 01:21:09,990 --> 01:21:11,310 It was like a blob. 1411 01:21:12,930 --> 01:21:15,600 Yeah, it's like, but I mean, it was within seriously, like a 1412 01:21:15,600 --> 01:21:20,160 week? They did. fireside was like, yeah, we're good. We're on 1413 01:21:20,160 --> 01:21:23,160 board. I was like, wow, that's fantastic. I think y'all were 1414 01:21:23,160 --> 01:21:27,360 the first one to start auto submitting to us. And, man, I 1415 01:21:27,360 --> 01:21:32,310 really appreciate that. Because so not you really, you because I 1416 01:21:32,310 --> 01:21:39,780 don't want I don't want to be scraping to try to get data, I 1417 01:21:39,780 --> 01:21:43,290 don't want to scrape Apple to try to find new feeds on a 1418 01:21:43,290 --> 01:21:47,430 contract basis. I just feel like this ideologically opposed to 1419 01:21:47,430 --> 01:21:50,910 the thing we're trying to do, which is not dependent on them. 1420 01:21:51,210 --> 01:21:54,300 So like, the only way to really make that happen is to have 1421 01:21:54,300 --> 01:21:59,490 independent streams of of data coming in that are giving dinner 1422 01:21:59,490 --> 01:22:03,450 handing you new feeds, and we get we get large dumps csvs 1423 01:22:03,450 --> 01:22:05,700 people sending it to us that's the part I 1424 01:22:05,700 --> 01:22:09,690 really enjoyed is there's there's definitely data guys out 1425 01:22:09,720 --> 01:22:13,500 in the in the universe, who've been collecting feeds and 1426 01:22:13,650 --> 01:22:18,930 categorizing them carefully, you know, Polish radio stations, all 1427 01:22:18,930 --> 01:22:21,330 kinds of interesting collections. And they show up 1428 01:22:21,360 --> 01:22:24,240 like, oh, here, here you go, I got 5000 feeds that you've never 1429 01:22:24,240 --> 01:22:26,550 heard of before. That's really cool. 1430 01:22:27,360 --> 01:22:31,230 It's been great. And then the host Yeah, the holsters auto 1431 01:22:31,230 --> 01:22:34,170 submitting like you guys, I mean, if everybody auto 1432 01:22:34,170 --> 01:22:38,490 submitted, because what we do is we we also expose a, you know, 1433 01:22:38,490 --> 01:22:42,930 an endpoint where every new feed that we get, we also publish 1434 01:22:42,930 --> 01:22:46,380 right back so you can, you know, you can follow it. So it's kind 1435 01:22:46,380 --> 01:22:50,130 of a clearinghouse model. And if everybody thought of submits 1436 01:22:50,130 --> 01:22:53,280 their new feats to us, then we can just hand them right back 1437 01:22:53,280 --> 01:22:56,370 out. And that can help other indexes to be created. 1438 01:22:56,370 --> 01:23:00,930 Absolutely. Yeah. And then and then we can, you know, we do we 1439 01:23:00,930 --> 01:23:02,460 can have redundancy, and don't 1440 01:23:02,460 --> 01:23:04,770 we have at least one index taking that in point? 1441 01:23:05,880 --> 01:23:08,100 I think pod versus pod verse, 1442 01:23:08,220 --> 01:23:11,220 take it maybe pod verse account, someone, someone somebody 1443 01:23:11,220 --> 01:23:15,180 does it? Yeah, yeah. But I think it's it, it, it's really nice to 1444 01:23:15,180 --> 01:23:20,850 see, to see everybody feeding to us, because even though we may 1445 01:23:20,850 --> 01:23:25,710 not have everything, you know, we're building slowly, and then, 1446 01:23:25,860 --> 01:23:29,160 you know, what we'll have at the end of the day is, is is a 1447 01:23:29,160 --> 01:23:33,750 decentralized index, where everybody can participate. And 1448 01:23:33,750 --> 01:23:37,860 you don't have to depend on, you know, what would be great is one 1449 01:23:37,860 --> 01:23:42,120 day, you know, is one day Apple participates as just another 1450 01:23:42,120 --> 01:23:45,870 peer, that'd be amazing. Yeah, instead, and that way, you 1451 01:23:45,870 --> 01:23:48,930 wouldn't have to depend on, you know, well, Apple rejected my 1452 01:23:48,930 --> 01:23:51,390 feed. And, you know, now I gotta do all this other stuff, and 1453 01:23:51,390 --> 01:23:54,300 resubmit, and wait five days to see if it gets okay. And all 1454 01:23:54,300 --> 01:23:57,270 this kind of jazz, you know, you just you just crank up your, you 1455 01:23:57,270 --> 01:24:00,960 know, your, your feed at that host at farside, or wherever, 1456 01:24:00,960 --> 01:24:05,430 and it just replicates through all the indexes in one shot. 1457 01:24:06,060 --> 01:24:06,900 You hear that Apple, 1458 01:24:06,930 --> 01:24:07,680 you hear that? 1459 01:24:09,780 --> 01:24:10,890 Take that endpoint I 1460 01:24:10,890 --> 01:24:15,090 love. I love what you guys are doing. And it's great to be a 1461 01:24:15,090 --> 01:24:17,760 because it feels very cutting edge. It feels like the first 1462 01:24:17,760 --> 01:24:23,100 thing that I've seen anybody do in this space in a long time, or 1463 01:24:23,100 --> 01:24:26,940 maybe at all, to really start to try to move things forward. And 1464 01:24:26,940 --> 01:24:32,490 you guys are doing it, not as a company like apple or Spotify, 1465 01:24:32,490 --> 01:24:35,220 who's doing it for monetization, you're doing it for the 1466 01:24:35,220 --> 01:24:37,470 community, you're doing it for the industry, you're doing it 1467 01:24:37,470 --> 01:24:40,650 for the podcasters and that any anything that like we can do to 1468 01:24:40,650 --> 01:24:44,580 support that is like, I don't see it as optional, although 1469 01:24:44,580 --> 01:24:47,670 it's fun to do, and I like it and I'm happy to when I'm doing 1470 01:24:47,670 --> 01:24:50,640 it. It's to me, it's like yeah, of course you're gonna do what 1471 01:24:50,640 --> 01:24:54,390 you need to do to support this industry. And and we appreciate 1472 01:24:54,390 --> 01:24:57,930 the support you've given because just participating, you know, 1473 01:24:57,960 --> 01:25:01,680 hitting the API with whatever is appropriate. That's exactly what 1474 01:25:01,680 --> 01:25:03,570 we need. And we really appreciate that this 1475 01:25:03,570 --> 01:25:08,640 is, of course, a value for value project. This is also a value 1476 01:25:08,640 --> 01:25:15,540 from value podcast. Again, to show how well this idea works, 1477 01:25:15,540 --> 01:25:18,930 if you say, Hey, are you listening? Are you using the 1478 01:25:18,930 --> 01:25:23,580 index the API? Is this valuable to you? What is that value? send 1479 01:25:23,580 --> 01:25:26,340 it back to us. Now, of course, we have a beautiful red Donate 1480 01:25:26,340 --> 01:25:30,600 button on podcast. index.org. We also have a lightning invoice 1481 01:25:30,600 --> 01:25:33,720 there, which from time to time, someone shows up and does a 1482 01:25:33,720 --> 01:25:37,020 subscription, which is really nice. We've had some really 1483 01:25:38,640 --> 01:25:42,480 gracious people who have been helping us out. Because Yeah, we 1484 01:25:42,480 --> 01:25:46,020 did start it from a from the entire value for value 1485 01:25:46,050 --> 01:25:49,110 perspective. If this is not valuable, it will dry up and 1486 01:25:49,110 --> 01:25:52,260 blow away. But it's not. And Dave, you have a couple of 1487 01:25:52,260 --> 01:25:55,770 people need to thank who have who sent in donations if you 1488 01:25:55,770 --> 01:25:59,070 don't mind. Damn, we're just gonna now of course, we got a 1489 01:25:59,070 --> 01:26:01,230 huge donation from an anonymous donor. 1490 01:26:01,740 --> 01:26:07,170 Yeah. And we we are Yeah, I can I can tell Dan wants to be in 1491 01:26:07,470 --> 01:26:09,420 donations. That means I can hear in his voice. Yes, 1492 01:26:09,450 --> 01:26:12,300 of course. He does. Absolutely. participate. Yes. Yeah. 1493 01:26:14,550 --> 01:26:20,070 See, here we got quite a few here. See Leslie Martin. Did a 1494 01:26:20,070 --> 01:26:26,940 to $2 a month subscription. Oh, and dandy. No, Leslie. And not 1495 01:26:26,940 --> 01:26:33,720 not that wall. Okay. Leslie Martin, says it. I'm sorry. 1496 01:26:36,150 --> 01:26:39,510 My wife. Like what's going on? 1497 01:26:41,070 --> 01:26:42,330 No, no, I 1498 01:26:42,330 --> 01:26:44,580 don't I thought Leslie may be in the Austin club. 1499 01:26:45,240 --> 01:26:48,690 Just trying to draw down into our value for value segment 1500 01:26:48,690 --> 01:26:50,430 aren't Yes. No matter what you do. 1501 01:26:51,330 --> 01:26:54,000 If that if she she 1502 01:26:54,000 --> 01:26:57,120 and I saw the Guns and Roses New Year's Eve concert. 1503 01:26:59,310 --> 01:27:01,320 Oh, that one? Yeah. 1504 01:27:01,740 --> 01:27:04,290 Is that is that the one where Axl Rose was two hours late or 1505 01:27:04,290 --> 01:27:05,190 two and a half hours late 1506 01:27:05,190 --> 01:27:07,890 guys. This is like a morning zoo. Now all of a sudden. 1507 01:27:12,870 --> 01:27:18,090 Like if that if Dan had a had a lightning node, we could put him 1508 01:27:18,090 --> 01:27:18,810 in the block 1509 01:27:19,590 --> 01:27:22,830 to show us right. That's right. All fall 1510 01:27:23,190 --> 01:27:24,870 into lightning. Node 1511 01:27:26,670 --> 01:27:29,940 voltage.io you can get it getting 1512 01:27:29,940 --> 01:27:30,990 paid right now. 1513 01:27:31,109 --> 01:27:32,159 Yes. As we 1514 01:27:32,160 --> 01:27:34,890 saw, I'm going as fast as I can. You'd be like, 1515 01:27:35,369 --> 01:27:38,279 like I could. I could do another podcast. I would just sit back 1516 01:27:38,279 --> 01:27:41,399 and watch this. A Toshi is rolling baby pass. That's the 1517 01:27:41,399 --> 01:27:43,739 choice you'll have to make 10 in a 1518 01:27:43,740 --> 01:27:50,100 month, you'd have $15 just like we did. Okay, so Leslie sent a 1519 01:27:50,100 --> 01:27:55,020 note and I don't know if Leslie I'm looking for keywords in here 1520 01:27:55,080 --> 01:27:58,320 where Leslie could say to give me a clue as to whether Leslie 1521 01:27:58,320 --> 01:28:01,680 is a boy or girl so it says 1522 01:28:02,130 --> 01:28:04,830 that that could that could that could be either couldn't Yep, 1523 01:28:04,890 --> 01:28:05,310 yeah, 1524 01:28:05,340 --> 01:28:09,690 yeah. First let me say that I'm not a developer. I don't work 1525 01:28:09,690 --> 01:28:13,350 for a hosting company. And I'm not currently a podcaster Oh, I 1526 01:28:13,350 --> 01:28:16,140 get well no, this doesn't help either. This is even my wife 1527 01:28:16,140 --> 01:28:18,090 doesn't listen to me these days 1528 01:28:18,660 --> 01:28:21,030 doesn't mean shit as a mattering doesn't matter. 1529 01:28:22,200 --> 01:28:26,910 Why would I think anyone else would want to listen to me but I 1530 01:28:26,910 --> 01:28:29,700 am a listener. Adams always talking about paying what 1531 01:28:29,700 --> 01:28:32,940 something is worth to you. My donation a mere $2 a month don't 1532 01:28:32,940 --> 01:28:33,660 call it mere 1533 01:28:33,720 --> 01:28:36,240 No, it's that's your value. Leslie. Yeah, 1534 01:28:36,330 --> 01:28:39,690 yeah, that's not mere doesn't reflect what the podcasts in the 1535 01:28:39,690 --> 01:28:42,570 index project are to me because I can't afford what I consider 1536 01:28:42,570 --> 01:28:44,790 to be their value. It's merely what I can afford. 1537 01:28:44,820 --> 01:28:48,600 Yeah, but that's on top value for you. So we really appreciate 1538 01:28:48,600 --> 01:28:48,930 that. 1539 01:28:49,290 --> 01:28:51,510 Yep. Thank you, Leslie. Appreciate that. Every 1540 01:28:51,510 --> 01:28:54,330 everything we there is no limit for reading donations on the 1541 01:28:54,330 --> 01:28:59,730 show. No. It's there's there's no bottom floor. Thank you, 1542 01:28:59,730 --> 01:29:04,620 Leslie. And, well, we had one cancellation of an automatic 1543 01:29:04,770 --> 01:29:08,010 subscription. That's that hurts. 1544 01:29:09,450 --> 01:29:11,640 How much was that? How much did you guys lose? 1545 01:29:12,000 --> 01:29:13,320 $10 that's, 1546 01:29:13,920 --> 01:29:17,040 that's that's an aggregate an aggregator server Yeah, yeah, 1547 01:29:17,190 --> 01:29:18,930 I shut it down shut it down. 1548 01:29:19,740 --> 01:29:26,730 Click Click Click man down Yes. And on that same note thank you 1549 01:29:26,730 --> 01:29:30,960 to our month our monthly donors because they a few more of those 1550 01:29:30,960 --> 01:29:35,280 came in and see them when they may when it when it auto pings 1551 01:29:35,280 --> 01:29:38,310 or whatever. And just want to make sure that that's that's my 1552 01:29:38,310 --> 01:29:39,300 guys know we love you. 1553 01:29:39,360 --> 01:29:43,020 That is so fantastic. Those recurring because, you know, we 1554 01:29:43,020 --> 01:29:46,710 literally set up an extra server. It's like Okay, good. We 1555 01:29:46,710 --> 01:29:48,390 know that's running. Appreciate it. 1556 01:29:48,840 --> 01:29:54,150 Yeah, this is this is bare bones here. Let's see. This says in 1557 01:29:54,150 --> 01:29:58,980 humongous letters. I don't know why this print. It's a Vegas as 1558 01:29:58,980 --> 01:30:03,270 I wish to remain unknown. nonnamous gave a gave a fiver to 1559 01:30:03,270 --> 01:30:07,170 podcast, excuse me, gave a fiver to pocket casts in order to 1560 01:30:07,170 --> 01:30:10,740 promote cut podcast 2.0 features left me feeling that you deserve 1561 01:30:10,740 --> 01:30:15,090 more. Thank you for your courage. And that is a $55. One 1562 01:30:15,090 --> 01:30:16,140 time, one time donation. 1563 01:30:16,170 --> 01:30:19,290 Thank you. So trying to get pocket casts on board. Good. 1564 01:30:19,350 --> 01:30:22,050 That's the work we need. That's appreciated. Thank you. 1565 01:30:22,980 --> 01:30:30,210 And our final donation is Wes young. Gave us $25 and his 1566 01:30:30,210 --> 01:30:32,700 message is keep on rockin. 1567 01:30:33,180 --> 01:30:34,920 So we will. 1568 01:30:35,430 --> 01:30:39,540 Thank you, Wes when we will hear $25 that enables us to rock 1569 01:30:39,840 --> 01:30:42,420 harder than you did before you get 1570 01:30:43,440 --> 01:30:45,750 how hard Are you rocking right now, Dave? Just want to make 1571 01:30:45,750 --> 01:30:48,540 sure are you on the high on the rock? ometer? Oh, yeah. 1572 01:30:48,600 --> 01:30:53,640 Oh, yeah. It's a mosh pit over here. See? Yeah, this is so as 1573 01:30:53,640 --> 01:30:54,510 our donors for this week. 1574 01:30:54,540 --> 01:30:57,900 Yeah, we appreciate everyone supporting the project. Again, 1575 01:30:57,900 --> 01:31:00,360 if you want to support us, if you get any value out of the 1576 01:31:00,360 --> 01:31:03,990 podcast or out of the the index itself, if you're using one of 1577 01:31:03,990 --> 01:31:07,230 the apps, of course, we really want you to prepare for 1578 01:31:07,230 --> 01:31:13,440 lightning and for podcasting 2.0. But right now, anything you 1579 01:31:13,440 --> 01:31:17,850 can spare anything you think is equal to the value you get out 1580 01:31:17,850 --> 01:31:22,290 of this, just go to podcast, index.org, Big Red Donate button 1581 01:31:22,290 --> 01:31:27,360 down at the bottom, and as well as a lightning invoice. And on 1582 01:31:27,360 --> 01:31:31,260 many apps, you should just be able to hit the the donut donut, 1583 01:31:31,290 --> 01:31:32,190 the donate button. 1584 01:31:32,520 --> 01:31:33,630 I want a donut. But don't 1585 01:31:36,630 --> 01:31:41,760 we need a new tag the donut donut tag? Yeah, that works 1586 01:31:41,760 --> 01:31:45,630 surprisingly well. I like that a lot when I'm when I use pod 1587 01:31:45,630 --> 01:31:48,090 friend as an example and then shows the donate button that 1588 01:31:48,090 --> 01:31:51,030 takes you right to the correct page that that interaction 1589 01:31:51,030 --> 01:31:53,040 turned out to work very well. 1590 01:31:53,640 --> 01:31:56,910 Y'all are doing the funding tag, right? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. 1591 01:31:56,910 --> 01:31:57,060 We 1592 01:31:57,060 --> 01:31:59,460 did all those first tags. So we've got all that in there. 1593 01:31:59,460 --> 01:32:01,020 Yeah. I like 1594 01:32:01,020 --> 01:32:04,350 the I like the funding tag. I know, there was There's our it 1595 01:32:04,350 --> 01:32:07,950 was already being done with some some other stuff with like, atom 1596 01:32:07,950 --> 01:32:10,530 links and that kind of thing. But I like the funding tag just 1597 01:32:10,530 --> 01:32:14,970 because I felt like it was worth sort of duplicating that 1598 01:32:14,970 --> 01:32:19,230 functionality. Because it's, it's simple. Like it simplifies 1599 01:32:19,230 --> 01:32:21,810 everything from an aggregator standpoint, it's just like, 1600 01:32:21,840 --> 01:32:23,820 funding link. Right? 1601 01:32:23,910 --> 01:32:24,660 Right. Hi. 1602 01:32:26,160 --> 01:32:30,090 The now I want to throw something in, sort of at the 1603 01:32:30,300 --> 01:32:33,930 back end of the donation segment here. If you're because people 1604 01:32:33,930 --> 01:32:40,530 request readwrite API keys, you know, on a, on a, on a regular 1605 01:32:40,530 --> 01:32:44,580 basis, I'm not going to grant permission for a readwrite key 1606 01:32:44,580 --> 01:32:48,090 unless we know who you are on the on. You need to join 1607 01:32:48,090 --> 01:32:54,720 podcasts index social and, and, and become like and speak. So we 1608 01:32:54,870 --> 01:32:59,490 so we know who you are, because we're we don't want shenanigans. 1609 01:32:59,610 --> 01:33:02,220 So for now, for now, this will change may change in the future. 1610 01:33:02,220 --> 01:33:05,130 But we need to kind of know what you what you are what you're 1611 01:33:05,130 --> 01:33:07,740 trying to do. I mean, it's fine to do test and you don't have to 1612 01:33:07,740 --> 01:33:10,470 be like us some kind of app, it's fine to just be playing 1613 01:33:10,470 --> 01:33:13,620 around but we we do want you to kind of make yourself known and 1614 01:33:13,680 --> 01:33:16,470 and understand what you're going to do before you begin to read 1615 01:33:16,470 --> 01:33:19,350 write key and you start dumping but you know loads of garbage 1616 01:33:19,380 --> 01:33:20,760 into the index. You know, that's we 1617 01:33:20,760 --> 01:33:22,620 haven't had any of that behavior. Have we? 1618 01:33:23,039 --> 01:33:26,579 No, no, no. All it No. Everybody's playing very nice. 1619 01:33:27,029 --> 01:33:27,539 Man. Is 1620 01:33:27,540 --> 01:33:30,690 there anything you'd like to see us do anything we can implement 1621 01:33:30,690 --> 01:33:35,040 streamline? Fix, make better work? How can we help you? Man, 1622 01:33:35,040 --> 01:33:35,160 I 1623 01:33:35,160 --> 01:33:37,710 love what you guys have been doing. Just Just keep it going. 1624 01:33:37,740 --> 01:33:41,970 And I really there's no, there's nothing else that I feel right 1625 01:33:41,970 --> 01:33:44,100 now you guys could really be doing better. I love the way 1626 01:33:44,100 --> 01:33:46,980 that you have launched all this stuff. Even though you were 1627 01:33:46,980 --> 01:33:50,250 criticizing it. I think it's actually been really fun. And it 1628 01:33:50,250 --> 01:33:53,940 feels like a real movement to me. And I love what y'all are 1629 01:33:53,940 --> 01:33:58,200 doing. I wish perfect. I'm saying you're perfect. I wish I 1630 01:33:58,200 --> 01:34:00,420 wish I had something to say I wish I was I was thinking oh, 1631 01:34:00,420 --> 01:34:03,330 you need this, you need that. But really, I love what you're 1632 01:34:03,330 --> 01:34:07,740 doing. And honestly, the input that you guys take from the 1633 01:34:07,740 --> 01:34:10,080 community and the way that you're building these different 1634 01:34:10,080 --> 01:34:14,100 things is so really thoughtful. And Gosh, I really couldn't 1635 01:34:14,100 --> 01:34:16,200 think of anything else to add. I like the direction that you're 1636 01:34:16,200 --> 01:34:20,850 going in. If you do, the one thing I might think of is 1637 01:34:21,690 --> 01:34:24,150 you soften the blow. Really No, 1638 01:34:24,150 --> 01:34:25,590 I just as I'm talking 1639 01:34:27,330 --> 01:34:29,310 on the pillow, you're sliding the pillow underneath, 1640 01:34:29,340 --> 01:34:37,140 maybe maybe you guys could keep going in this direction that you 1641 01:34:37,140 --> 01:34:41,400 were talking about with chapters and help bring awareness to what 1642 01:34:41,400 --> 01:34:46,740 else chapters can do. Because I really don't think that people 1643 01:34:46,740 --> 01:34:49,380 understand the potential that's there for chapters that think 1644 01:34:49,380 --> 01:34:51,480 they think of it as like, well. This is segment one, this 1645 01:34:51,480 --> 01:34:55,740 segment two, segment three, but that almost to me is a way to 1646 01:34:55,740 --> 01:34:58,500 get audience engagement even if they're just looking because a 1647 01:34:58,500 --> 01:35:01,740 lot of the time people when they put up podcasts on, it's playing 1648 01:35:01,740 --> 01:35:03,720 in their house or they're doing what they're doing while they're 1649 01:35:03,720 --> 01:35:05,730 jogging or they're on the treadmill, or they're doing 1650 01:35:05,730 --> 01:35:08,430 dishes or walking the dog. So they're not even aware that 1651 01:35:08,640 --> 01:35:11,850 these images are popping up on their right on their things. So 1652 01:35:11,850 --> 01:35:14,970 I think there's there's an educational aspect to to the 1653 01:35:14,970 --> 01:35:18,330 podcaster. And to the audience that there's more to it than 1654 01:35:18,330 --> 01:35:22,200 that. But I just anything that you guys can be thinking about, 1655 01:35:22,860 --> 01:35:26,430 for that kind of engagement, whether it's coming up with 1656 01:35:26,430 --> 01:35:29,850 this, because I believe if we put out a if you guys put out a 1657 01:35:29,850 --> 01:35:35,430 really good standard that made it possible for podcast 1658 01:35:35,430 --> 01:35:41,730 applications to record not in a creepy way would have to be opt 1659 01:35:41,730 --> 01:35:45,210 in but record what Liz listeners are actually doing. Are they 1660 01:35:45,210 --> 01:35:47,100 pausing? Are they playing? Are they finishing the whole 1661 01:35:47,100 --> 01:35:49,680 episode? Are they skipping something, if there was a 1662 01:35:49,680 --> 01:35:53,520 centralized reporting service that was open, that apps could 1663 01:35:53,520 --> 01:35:57,510 tie into to do that if their users opted in, and that it 1664 01:35:57,510 --> 01:36:00,660 could then though, that could be reported back to the host that 1665 01:36:00,660 --> 01:36:03,630 would make all of my customers so happy. So that's I don't know 1666 01:36:03,630 --> 01:36:06,660 how that would work or what that would look like. But it would 1667 01:36:06,660 --> 01:36:12,150 need to be a trusted third party to do it. It couldn't be that 1668 01:36:12,150 --> 01:36:15,510 overcast is collecting it, and then doing something with it, it 1669 01:36:15,510 --> 01:36:19,260 would have to be reported clean reporting it to to a third party 1670 01:36:19,260 --> 01:36:21,840 and you guys should be the third party. So no big but just 1671 01:36:22,710 --> 01:36:25,740 I don't know, if we want to be the third party, I 1672 01:36:25,740 --> 01:36:27,540 don't think you do. But I want you to be. 1673 01:36:28,289 --> 01:36:31,289 Thank you. I appreciate that. And by the way, for those of you 1674 01:36:31,289 --> 01:36:36,419 listening right now, I want you to make sure you listen to this 1675 01:36:36,449 --> 01:36:41,489 podcast and either pod friend go to web dot pod friend comm or 1676 01:36:41,489 --> 01:36:45,119 get a hyper catcher, because at this very moment, if you look at 1677 01:36:45,119 --> 01:36:48,599 your your your app screen, you will see a picture of Dan 1678 01:36:48,659 --> 01:36:54,779 Benjamin, right there. Look how he looks on 3654. Okay, I'm 1679 01:36:54,779 --> 01:36:59,459 putting that in? Well, the frayed picture will prove Oh, 1680 01:36:59,489 --> 01:37:06,299 it'll be the goat obviously. Yeah, yeah. Well, the short The 1681 01:37:06,299 --> 01:37:09,659 short answer to your to your listening statistics we've 1682 01:37:09,659 --> 01:37:12,599 discussed, you know that there is a way to do that. And it's 1683 01:37:12,599 --> 01:37:18,389 completely trustless yet verified and an accurate. That 1684 01:37:18,899 --> 01:37:23,669 is no third party. Okay. Everyone has their own data? 1685 01:37:24,420 --> 01:37:26,130 Well, yeah, that would work. 1686 01:37:27,960 --> 01:37:33,540 And is the Yeah, I was thinking. Do you guys, this may be off 1687 01:37:33,540 --> 01:37:37,260 top. But does farside the support web sub? 1688 01:37:38,220 --> 01:37:39,360 Oh, that's a good question. 1689 01:37:39,810 --> 01:37:42,990 Um, you know, we've had, it would be very, very easy for me 1690 01:37:42,990 --> 01:37:48,150 to roll that out. I've had a few requests for it. And actually, I 1691 01:37:48,150 --> 01:37:52,380 have a branch that has that working in it. Should we Is it 1692 01:37:52,380 --> 01:37:53,190 important? It's 1693 01:37:53,190 --> 01:37:56,040 something we should have? I think so. We're, 1694 01:37:56,579 --> 01:37:58,079 when is this episode coming out? 1695 01:37:59,250 --> 01:38:03,630 Today Today in like, 30 minutes? Yeah. Oh, well, it 1696 01:38:03,630 --> 01:38:06,450 won't be it won't be done by the time that the episode comes out. 1697 01:38:06,450 --> 01:38:09,660 But give me what you're getting in? Well, I gotta go eat some 1698 01:38:09,660 --> 01:38:10,200 lunch. 1699 01:38:12,330 --> 01:38:16,080 Yeah, web service is helps us a lot. 1700 01:38:16,440 --> 01:38:19,080 Does it all implement that? I'll have it beginning of next week 1701 01:38:19,080 --> 01:38:19,380 for you. 1702 01:38:20,820 --> 01:38:22,830 I love about Dan. Nice. 1703 01:38:23,280 --> 01:38:23,910 Next week. No 1704 01:38:23,910 --> 01:38:24,330 problem. 1705 01:38:25,110 --> 01:38:28,800 Yeah, that's great. Like, cuz I'm gonna do it. 1706 01:38:28,830 --> 01:38:31,500 What do you want me to say it should submit to that Google the 1707 01:38:31,500 --> 01:38:32,370 Google one, right? 1708 01:38:32,820 --> 01:38:36,480 Sure. Yeah, you can start there. They're they're not super. I've 1709 01:38:36,480 --> 01:38:40,980 got will tell me what I use. No, no, no, it's, that one's fine. 1710 01:38:41,010 --> 01:38:45,060 That one's fine. I think it's, it may be the only one that's 1711 01:38:45,060 --> 01:38:49,350 free. But what I was thinking of is the one you know, I wonder if 1712 01:38:49,770 --> 01:38:51,570 you could do it just in house. 1713 01:38:53,100 --> 01:38:56,220 Is that just run my own? run my own one? Yeah, sure. I 1714 01:38:56,220 --> 01:38:58,800 don't care. Yeah, I don't I don't know that. I don't know 1715 01:38:58,800 --> 01:38:59,610 what's out there. 1716 01:38:59,670 --> 01:39:01,830 But is that what you want me to do? Because I'll do that for 1717 01:39:01,830 --> 01:39:02,010 you. 1718 01:39:02,430 --> 01:39:07,350 Because here's the problem. I think, based on what I have seen 1719 01:39:07,680 --> 01:39:12,390 that the app, was it pub sub, pub sub hub dot app, spot.com, 1720 01:39:12,390 --> 01:39:18,240 which is the worst domain name in the history. So I think that, 1721 01:39:18,480 --> 01:39:21,870 that Google, that's Google's public one I think, I don't know 1722 01:39:21,870 --> 01:39:24,180 if it's overloaded or what that 1723 01:39:24,510 --> 01:39:27,060 is missing stuff. It's missing stuff. Yeah, 1724 01:39:27,119 --> 01:39:31,229 it is missing things. And it's it's not it's not reliable. I 1725 01:39:31,229 --> 01:39:36,119 think it's about it's about 75% which is enough to kind of be a 1726 01:39:36,119 --> 01:39:41,489 problem. And we thought about the we thought about being an 1727 01:39:41,489 --> 01:39:45,749 open as well. Now I don't know if we can you know, like the 1728 01:39:45,749 --> 01:39:48,779 volume obviously becomes a problem. When you're talking 1729 01:39:48,779 --> 01:39:52,049 about trying to be in anytime you do something free. Oh, 1730 01:39:52,049 --> 01:39:55,019 you're gonna get you're gonna get hammered. But I was thinking 1731 01:39:55,019 --> 01:40:01,019 you know if if the hosts ran their own Yo yo can handle that 1732 01:40:01,019 --> 01:40:05,069 traffic because the traffic for each for each one is not super 1733 01:40:05,069 --> 01:40:10,949 high. Mm hmm. And it may make things much more reliable. I 1734 01:40:10,949 --> 01:40:13,469 don't know. I'm just throwing that out there. Stone. I 1735 01:40:13,470 --> 01:40:15,570 like that idea. I think there's something there. 1736 01:40:16,110 --> 01:40:17,910 I will look into that. For sure. 1737 01:40:17,910 --> 01:40:18,180 Okay. 1738 01:40:18,900 --> 01:40:23,670 All right, Dan Benjamin, running fireside in Austin, Texas. five 1739 01:40:23,670 --> 01:40:26,820 by five. What else? Anything else we need to promote for you? 1740 01:40:27,270 --> 01:40:27,810 Man, you've 1741 01:40:27,810 --> 01:40:30,270 promoted so much for me already. I couldn't ask for anything 1742 01:40:30,270 --> 01:40:33,300 else. fireside.fm is the thing we've been talking about this 1743 01:40:33,300 --> 01:40:37,380 whole time and shows it five by five. tv and Gosh, that's it, 1744 01:40:37,380 --> 01:40:39,720 guys. Thank you. Thanks so much for having me. I'm thrilled to 1745 01:40:39,720 --> 01:40:40,320 be here. 1746 01:40:40,650 --> 01:40:43,170 The new area 57 podcast with Dan Benjamin. 1747 01:40:43,950 --> 01:40:44,640 Yeah. 1748 01:40:47,520 --> 01:40:51,000 Alright guys, thank you both very much. It was a great way to 1749 01:40:51,000 --> 01:40:55,260 kick off the weekend. Perfect Friday, and we'll see you all 1750 01:40:55,260 --> 01:40:57,210 over there at the index. Thanks, Dan. 1751 01:40:57,540 --> 01:40:58,110 Thank you. 1752 01:40:58,380 --> 01:40:59,490 Alright, everybody. That's it. 1753 01:41:01,140 --> 01:41:02,040 Break it down. 1754 01:41:02,850 --> 01:41:05,340 We'll be back next week to bring you another Friday board meeting 1755 01:41:05,340 --> 01:41:13,980 of podcasting. 2.0 1756 01:41:23,790 --> 01:41:25,380 listening to podcasts. 1757 01:41:26,730 --> 01:41:30,510 Visit podcasts. For more information.